Saber Forum

Where there's smoke there's fire. I have been thinking that because of all the behind the scenes shenanigans at Warner Bros with regards to the DCEU that Ben Affleck has been strategically been trying to distance himself from the films. And now comes this rumour.
http://screenrant.com/batman-ben-affleck-leaving-role/?utm_source=SR-FB-P&utm_medium=Social-Distribution&utm_campaign=SR-FB-P&view=list

Sounds like people are making mountains out of molehills.

I was watching movie talk last night and John Campea said that he has spoken to two separate sources connected with the DC films at Warner and they have said that Ben wants out. However, Campea did say that this is just what he was told and that it is not confirmed or anything. But, add that to Affleck committed to directing and then a couple of weeks later dropping off the project, plus his crotchety comments during the press tours for Live By Night (because so many people asked about Batman rather than his new movie) and all the other turmoil they are having, it is not beyond the bounds of possibility.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want him to leave, but I just have this feeling that he will do sooner rather than later.

Or this could all be a clever marketing ploy, as DC knows they have been losing ground to both Marvel and the DC TV properties.

So far, Ben has been the only person to be able to pull of the Batman that I want. Well along with Kevin. ::)

The DCEU:

(https://media.giphy.com/media/CseM0MUzUUzcI/200.gif)

Is that Phillip Seymour Hoffman?

Yes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3P-f-8Lfcs

Is that a serious outtake from a commercial shoot or a clip from a comedy show?

It's from PUNCH-DRUNK LOVE!!!!!  ;D

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0272338/

It is a parody of this actual commercial outtake though:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQs_sSblIZ4

Ah. Never seen it, which is why it didn't look familiar. (#RIPpshoffman)

Anyway, back to DC and the Bat, what with the rumours of  Affleck leaving, plus all the Flash mishegoss, I worry that even if Wonder Woman and Justice League are both great that Warner Bros may just do Flashpoint and reboot the universe because of all the chaos and ill-will that is currently out there. Meanwhile, with their latest Infinity War video announcement, Marvel are (inadvertently) making DC look extremely incompetent.

Maybe it's like LB said, and their doing it to take everybody off guard with the quality of these next films.

Maybe. But looking at their track record so far: MoS trailer looked good and the film was (to me) a let down. Not bad, just not outstanding. BvS, great trailers (apart from the spoilery one that showed Doomsday), and the film was awful (to me and lots of other people) and not liked by critics either. Suicide Squad had a GREAT trailer and I thought it would be GOTG levels of quirky awesomeness. And yet again, the movie was a massive letdown.

DC know how to make great trailers, which is what has me so worried for Wonder Woman, as everything in the trailers so far looks Totes Amazeballs. But I am nervous because of everything that has come before. I will give it a go, because I WANT the movies to be good, but if they aren't I won't be an apologist and make excuses for them, as we have had many many great comic book movies from other studios, there really is not excuse for making a bad one these days.

So, somebody heard that somebody said that somebody was thinking.  That's basically what I got out of that "article."  Well, that and this:


And you get paid to write.  ::)  I was reading that trying to figure out what he was staring at, then I realized they spelled starring wrong.

Not sure if you read my earlier post:

I read it and it still sounds like hearsay.  Nobody heard this firsthand from Ben or WB.  Until one makes a statement, we don't know anything concrete.

Which Campea did say. And as stated in the thread title, this is a rumour.

However, rumours or not, my Spidey-sense keeps tingling on this point

I know it's a rumor and one I'm hoping isn't true.  However, I'm worried as well.  As I said, I'm waiting for a statement from Ben or WB.  So, why haven't they issued one?  I mean, if it's just somebody blowing smoke, they sure aren't easing anyone's fears by renouncing the rumor, are they?  The question is: Why?  The best way to squash a rumor is to release a "No, I'm/he's not leaving" statement.  I suspect lack of such statement is why your finely tuned Spidey sense is tingling.

I suspect that, while this is all hearsay, there is at least some truth to this rumor.  Ben probably wants out and WB is trying to convince him to stay.  Otherwise, they would have made a statement.

Very well said. Although the whole situation is strange. Batfleck was one of the BEST things about BvS. And back in December Ben was totally enthusiastic about directing the movie. Then a few weeks later we hear that there may be problems with the script (but he was the on writing it). Then he swears on Jimmy Kimmel that he's directing. About a week or so later the news comes out that he is now NOT directing. And now all these rumours.

Why are DC having so many problems? Is it too many cooks syndrome? Trying too hard to play catch up? Is Ben not happy with the direction Justice League has gone which made it hard for him to write a good story with the character set after that movie?

I know it's all speculation, but this is the digital age and that's what fans do. As you said, the most worrying aspect is that neither Ben nor WB have done anything to confront these rumours.

Yeah, I think DC/WB needs some help.  Too many cooks in the kitchen has been an issue of theirs for a while.  Studio interference has been the downfall of many of their movies and franchises.  And, if one of the best Actor/Writer/Directors on the planet is getting fed up and wants to leave, that's not a good sign.  I've gotta say, I love the extended cut of BvS, but Ben definitely made that movie great.  I don't even know how they'd go about replacing him.

I agree. I was not the biggest fan of BvS, but the extended cut was better and fixed a lot of the issues I had with the theatrical release. It's still not great though. But Ben's performance as the Bat was standout.

If you look the grit he brought in The Town and the build of suspense in Argo, why wouldn't you want him directing this movie? And it's not just Ben. Look at the issues they are having with The Flash movie.

I know that DC want to have a cinematic universe (and are playing catch up with Marvel) but I think the best thing they could do is decide what the end game is; what is it that they want the movies to build towards? Darkseid and Apokolips? If that's the idea, they decide how each movie preceding that end game can build towards it. Currently the movies seem very haphazard and reactionary and that is never a good thing. Have a plan, stick to the plan, commit. Once you have a director on board who agrees to create your vision, LEAVE THEM ALONE once filming starts. And again when they are editing.

Maybe DC will get their sh*t together eventually. But will they have damaged the brand too much by that point for audiences to want a DCEU anymore? It will be interesting to see what Wonder Woman is like. Not sure how much they interfered with Patty Jenkins on that one.

Well, MCU has had since Iron Man to set up the whole MCU. DC is just trying to get up to their level, but since they don't have the same amount of time, it isn't working. I think WW will be good because it is based in WWI. That alone should help make it great. Plus Gal and Chris are both great actors. I am looking forward to WW.

I agree with Taegin Roan.  Trying to catch up with Marvel overnight is definitely a bad idea.  I mean, the MCU is so finely crafted, and it was done over a series of years.  I mean, it's as subtle a buildup as 2008's The Incredible Hulk having references to Captain America in it.  They were trying to create more Steve Rogers style super soldiers, which led to the serum they gave Emil Blonsky, which in turn led to him becoming Abomination.  That kind of plot work is carefully crafted and subtle, it was all in a simple conversation that you could miss if you weren't paying attention.  Captain America: The First Avenger came along a full three years later and wasn't rushed, yet those people who were paying attention knew it was coming.  Similarly, there was the build up to the Avengers, which started in the post credits scene in Iron Man in 2008.  The Avengers came out four years later.  And, so on.  The pacing was slow and methodical, with a buildup.

DC can't replicate that kind of work in two years, no matter how hard they try.  And, shoving as many characters into a single standalone film as you can right off the bat isn't a good start.  I'm looking forward to Wonder Woman and The Justice League, but it's a nervous type of anticipation.

They would definitely be fools to let Ben go.  I don't know why he's not directing the film anymore, but I lost a lot of hope in it when I found that out.  If they let him go entirely, they might as well call the whole thing off.  People want Batfleck, they don't want some other guy stepping into the cape and cowl for a standalone film.  I don't remember if I ever saw The Town. I think I meant to but never did.  Argo is excellent.  That man knows how to make great films.

I agree that it is a mistake to try and catch up to Marvel's current level in just a few movies. Therein lies one of WB's major problems.

However, as I have said before on another thread, look at the first three MCU movies and compare them to WB's first three movies:

MCU-
Ironman
Incredible Hulk
Ironman 2

DC-
Man of Steel
Batman vs Superman
Suicide Squad

As much as I like the MCU, Ironman 2 was rushed into production before they were ready and Incredible Hulk isn't great either. Neither is awful. The first Ironman is one of the greatest comic book movies ever though. However, for some reason, people are not as understanding with DC's releases so far. I think that is because when the first three MCU movies were released the marketplace wasn't saturated with comic book movies like they are now.

In addition, I think WB waited too long to kick off their cinematic universe. While Marvel were taking their time and crafting a cohesive whole for the stories, WB were just sitting back and watching. Also, the only movies Marvel Studios makes are MCU movies. That's it. WB do not have a dedicated comic book division, which I think also contributes to their problems.

The end game of the current MCU movies planned has always been Infinity War. Every movie released has been a stepping stone (big or small) towards that goal. What is the goal of the DC movies? Do they have a goal? Do they have a plan beyond releasing movies in order to capitalise on the current box office success of comic book movies? It seems, no.

The Honest Trailers to BvS said as much. In that one movie they tried to:

Be a sequel to MoS
Introduce a new Batman
Introduce Wonder Woman
Plant seeds of Justice League
Foreshadow Darkseid and Apokolips
Show Doomsday
Have the death of Superman story

ALL IN ONE MOVIE!!!! And yet they wonder why the film was bashed by so many people.

Unfortunately, the character of Batman will always be bigger than the actor playing him. As great as Batfleck is, if/when they recast him people will probably accept it (eventually). As for directing, Affleck is a great director (you really should watch The Town. It's a Boston set crime movie and is REALLY good) but there are any number of equally great directors out there who could do as good a job. Basically, WB is mishandling the whole situation.

I'm probably one of the few people on the planet who has little to no issues with Iron Man 2.  I like it.  But then, I like Suicide Squad too.  Though, much like BvS, I've only seen the extended cut of Suicide Squad, so I don't know how the theatrical cut was.  But, that's just me.  I freely admit to being an oddball.  ;)

You're not alone on Ironman 2. I like it too, despite the apparent flaws that peopl highlight. In fact i say it's a better movie than Ironman 3. Neither is a patch on the original though, but that first one set a really high standard.

I've not seen the extended cut of SS yet. Although, much like BvS, I refuse to spend my hard earned cash on it. Might put it on the list for my birthday presents in April. I liked the chemistry of the squad, Harley was great, Diablo was great and the Fresh Prince did what the Fresh Prince does, but the story was a mess.

I haven't watched Suicide Squad yet, but I will eventually. The only movie in the MCU that I haven't watched is Iron Man 3. I don't really know if Hulk counts as MCU, but I haven't watched it either. I enjoyed BvS and MoS. Mostly because of all the Easter eggs that were in them. I loved all the stuff in Batman's dream, because it leads up to everything else in the DC universe. MoS I thought was good, yes it had it's problems, but it gave us a Superman that wasn't without a weakness. With MoS and BvS we are shown that Supes has other weaknesses besides Kryptonite. He feels he has a calling to help, but then when Martha gets taken, he knows that he cannot do it alone, and he needs help. This is the kind of thing that makes Supes great. And I wont even get into Wonder Woman.

Hulk isn't MCU.  I like it, though.  The Incredible Hulk is the reboot that got the character into the MCU.  I didn't care for Iron Man 3.  Parts were good, other parts not so much.  I thought the end was ridiculous.

I don't know if there is a difference between Hulk and The Incredible Hulk. I was using Hulk because I didn't want to type out The Incredible Hulk. I have heard that about IM3 from most people. I will still watch it sometime, but that doesn't mean I will like it.

Hulk was the crappy Ang Lee movie starring Eric Bana that had laughably bad CGI, horrifically bad lighting, comic style panels that distracted from the movie, and a Hulked-out poodle.

The Incredible Hulk was the Ed Norton movie with much better effects, story, cast, lighting, and a tie in with the MCU.

The only good thing about Ang Lee's Hulk was the legend that is Sam Elliott as Thunderbolt Ross.

As for Ed Norton's Hulk, officially it is part of the MCU. However Universal own distribution rights to any standalone Hulk movies, which is why he appears in other movies with other characters rather than his own adventure. This is also why they have put him in Thor Ragnarok as a clever way of doing the Planet Hulk storyline without Universal getting in the way. (It's all politics and marketing deals! Lol)