Makeshift Unorthodox Costume (In Progress)

[DarthProdigal]

Thank you for the detailed response. That makes a lot of sense. I don't have much experience with weapon sparring, but I know in my time sparring with hands and feet in TKD, pads only covered the front and sides of the torso. Kicking to the back was not allowed, or at least not scored a point, even though it did of course happen, intentionally or otherwise. It also looks like the Kendo chest/torso gear doesn't cover the back either? So it doesn't seem entirely unfounded that weapon sparring armor for blunt weapons must inherently always cover the back?

Either way, I already ordered the sleeveless motorcycle armor that has chest, back, and shoulder pads. Hopefully it fits well and is of sufficient quality to do its job, since the price was great.

Yep it doesn't have wrap around coverage... The sides do go back part of the way, but like I mentioned an "enthusiastic" strike from enough of an angled sidestep (with the blade's reach) would pair together with the natural blade flexibility to still get you on occasion. Man did we wind up with some bruises from "near misses" attempted on targets some of the time. It's hard to hit a wrist perfectly, within a 6" zone, on a moving target, especially when they don't want you to hit them, and are trying to defend/strike you. But we were all adults, it was in good fun, and no harm was meant so no real ill will after. Ironically the same gear is used for Kumdo where I've both heard and seen training with multiple opponents simultaneously. So idk exactly why then never adapted a full coverage torso piece to that extent? Maybe the idea is just to not let them hit you from behind, or it's frowned upon heavily? Guess you have to let someone "test whack" you across the front/back of it a few time when it arrives to find out if it really works.

The danger of missing slightly is why I'd guess the rules of lightsaber swordplay for points doesn't allow or frowns upon thrusts? ...they are inherently quite dangerous! Especially since the Kendo "target on the neck" leaves you striking them in the neck if you miss worst case! Plus stabbing at the chest can naturally follow the momentum upward into the throat. It's pretty dang inadvisable (in fact it wasn't allowed to any novices to even attempt!) trying it especially with a "hardened" blade like lightsabers could likely collapse a windpipe if done foolishly or with excessive force. It was always an upper level target only used between practiced professionals with bamboo swords in my experience there! So yeah, I'd say to really avoid it to the head or chest basically, just my opinion. I could see it exclusively being used for stage combat with VERY limited light sparring applications (if ever) and only agreed upon in advance by very experienced duelists.

[SirLiftaLot]

Yep it doesn't have wrap around coverage... The sides do go back part of the way, but like I mentioned an "enthusiastic" strike from enough of an angled sidestep (with the blade's reach) would pair together with the natural blade flexibility to still get you on occasion. Man did we wind up with some bruises from "near misses" attempted on targets some of the time. It's hard to hit a wrist perfectly, within a 6" zone, on a moving target, especially when they don't want you to hit them, and are trying to defend/strike you. But we were all adults, it was in good fun, and no harm was meant so no real ill will after. Ironically the same gear is used for Kumdo where I've both heard and seen training with multiple opponents simultaneously. So idk exactly why then never adapted a full coverage torso piece to that extent? Maybe the idea is just to not let them hit you from behind, or it's frowned upon heavily? Guess you have to let someone "test whack" you across the front/back of it a few time when it arrives to find out if it really works.

The danger of missing slightly is why I'd guess the rules of lightsaber swordplay for points doesn't allow or frowns upon thrusts? ...they are inherently quite dangerous! Especially since the Kendo "target on the neck" leaves you striking them in the neck if you miss worst case! Plus stabbing at the chest can naturally follow the momentum upward into the throat. It's pretty dang inadvisable (in fact it wasn't allowed to any novices to even attempt!) trying it especially with a "hardened" blade like lightsabers could likely collapse a windpipe if done foolishly or with excessive force. It was always an upper level target only used between practiced professionals with bamboo swords in my experience there! So yeah, I'd say to really avoid it to the head or chest basically, just my opinion. I could see it exclusively being used for stage combat with VERY limited light sparring applications (if ever) and only agreed upon in advance by very experienced duelists.

Yeah, I think I'll have someone give me a few good test whacks to see if it's functional enough for at least medium sparring or not.

Based on the info from Rogue Saber Academy, they have light, medium, and heavy armor.

LIGHT:

This is a popular choice if you want to attract the largest numbers of participants, especially new duelists. Light Armor is inexpensive, easy to find, and easy to wear in hot weather. This minimalist approach is similar to how the Jedi fight as peace-keepers in the Star Wars universe. Stabbing and head attacks are outlawed if this armor type is selected. However, even as duelists actively try to avoid the head and face (compromising many martial aspects of the sport) injury may occur, making this the least safe option. This armor class is similar to those found in Ludosport, The Saber Authority, and in many costumed performance-based groups.

Required: (1.) Gloves which are at least moderately padded with covered fingers to avoid breakage of the skin such as climbing gloves, padded lineman gloves, or thick leather gloves. (2.) An athletic cup or protective sport cup for male duelists.

Recommended: (1.) Eye Protection with a strap to avoid slippage in a match such as sport goggles, safety goggles, or other secure protective eye wear.

Optional: (1.) A common teeth-protective mouth guard.

MEDIUM:

For experienced fighters looking for a more authentic battle, Medium armor provides a good middle-ground compromise. It is not as expensive as Heavy Armor, and protects a great deal more than Light Armor. This approach is similar to how the Jedi fight as generals in the Star Wars franchise. Attacks to the head from above or the side are permitted, however all stabs are still forbidden with this armor class. Unfortunately, you may be turned away from some of the most intense of events if you only have Medium Armor. This armor class is similar to those found in the The Terra Prime Lightsaber Academy, The Lightspeed Saber League, and The Saber Legion (for sparring).

Required: (1.) A mask/helmet with mesh to protect the face (not just a metal cage or face guard) and with protection from above and sides such as a fencing mask, hockey goalie mask, HEMA mask, or kendo men bōgu. (2.) An athletic cup or protective sport cup for male duelists. (3.) Heavily padded gloves such as fencing gloves, padded fighting gloves, hockey gloves, lacrosse gloves, or HEMA gloves.

Recommended: (1.) Padded (not hard plated) protective arm sleeves such as arm guards or arm pads.

Optional: Additional shoulder, chest, and/or stomach protection (see the Heavy Armor section for more information).

HEAVY:

Heavy Armor allows for a full experience of the intense historical and martial realism that the sport can provide. This approach is similar to how the Sith Lords and imperial or republic soldiers armored themselves in the many massive conquests in the Star Wars Universe. As all of the armor can cost over $1,000 together, it is an option only for a section of the community. stabbing and head attacks are allowed when this armor class is used, however all other safety standards and rules apply. This armor class is similar to those found in San Diego Sabers or The Saber Legion (for tournaments).

Required: (1.) A mask/helmet with mesh to protect the face (not just a metal cage or face guard) and with protection from above, sides, and from BEHIND such as some types of fencing masks, hockey goalie masks, or HEMA masks. (2.) An athletic cup or protective sport cup for male duelists. (3.) Heavily padded gloves such as fencing gloves, padded fighting gloves, hockey gloves, lacrosse gloves, or HEMA gloves. (4.) Plated neck and throat protection (the larger the better, made not just of fabric) such as a HEMA gorget, throat guard, or goalie neck guard. (5.) Hard-plated shoulder, chest, and back protection such as (in combination as needed) HEMA body armor, hockey shoulder pads, lacrosse shoulder pads, umpire chest protector, kendo do (dou) bōgu, plated sport body armor, and/or body pad (protector). (6.) Heavily padded or plated knee AND shin protection such as (soccer / hockey / lacrosse / skating / motorcycle...) knee shin guards or knee pads and shin protector. (7.) Elbow protection such as (hockey / lacrosse / skating / motorcycle...) sport elbow pads or elbow guards.

Optional: (1.) Padded (not hard plated) protective arm sleeves such as arm guards or arm pads.

So I'd be at least at the medium with the fencing mask and the motorcycle armor. Even if the motorcycle armor isn't optimal, it's better than literally nothing I'd hope, since chest armor is optional for medium.

Actual throat protection becomes necessary for Heavy class, and hard plated chest, shoulder, and back protection. As well as back-of-the-head protection.

So if I have the motorcycle armor gloves, a fencing mask, padded (not hard) forearm guards, motorcycle chest/shoulder/back armor, padded shin and knee guards, and a padded girdle with medium/soft hip, thigh, tailbone pads, and a cup, I should at least be good to go for any medium class. So to go to heavy class, I'd either have to think the motorcycle armor I have on the way is sufficient (which I'd say it probably isn't for true heavy sparring, since it isn't armored on the entirety of the chest even), or get something different for torso armor, figure out something for back-of-the-head protection, and also for neck protection.

But I think medium level would be more than enough, and would be more than enough intensity for a long time for me. So back protection wouldn't be an absolute necessity there, and if I had to pick optimal chest/shoulder armor or less than adequate chest/shoulder armor to add back armor, the latter is probably just sacrificing some good coverage for no good coverage. But hopefully the motorcycle armor will be sufficient for medium sparring.

[DarthProdigal]

Oh yeah, that Heavy Armor is for full speed, full contact, savagery where you're brutally contesting those points! Sounds IMO much less like "friendly competition" and more like I'm winning this! Ugh, I'll get there eventually, but it's true. Collecting all the pieces gets a bit expensive and not everyone is THAT intent on sparring, especially to that level. It's a select breed for sure, it sounds worth it to me though from personal experience and desires. Funny how that reference highlights Sith or Imperials as Heavies VS Jedi armor as Midgrade. Too true. Jedi mentality "I'll block blaster bolts or fight as needed" Sith "Come at me bro, nah all of you at once! My armor can take it and I can take you!"

I just made myself laugh till I cried on that one, oh man. Terrible.

[SirLiftaLot]

Oh yeah, that Heavy Armor is for full speed, full contact, savagery where you're brutally contesting those points! Sounds IMO much less like "friendly competition" and more like I'm winning this! Ugh, I'll get there eventually, but it's true. Collecting all the pieces gets a bit expensive and not everyone is THAT intent on sparring, especially to that level. It's a select breed for sure, it sounds worth it to me though from personal experience and desires. Funny how that reference highlights Sith or Imperials as Heavies VS Jedi armor as Midgrade. Too true. Jedi mentality "I'll block blaster bolts or fight as needed" Sith "Come at me bro, nah all of you at once! My armor can take it and I can take you!"

I just made myself laugh till I cried on that one, oh man. Terrible.

Totally agreed with you there. It's something cool and fun to aim towards, but I'm nowhere near ready for that yet! The way I see it, with that much armor, if stabbing and full-speed swings and strikes are allowed, I'd be super tempted to want to also be allowed to kick, even though that really doesn't mesh with the generally accepted idea of lightsaber sparring. I mean, a kick shouldn't count for a point, but kicking to create space, or stagger an opponent for a strike, is something that's far from alien in the Star Wars universe. And the reach of a kick isn't really the same as a lightsaber blade outstretched, so they could always in theory strike your leg for a point, so it's a risky move, and more of a situational tool than an anything I'd say. So if you're going for maximum realism, neglecting that seems like it would be leaving some realism out I'd say. But I guess you also don't want untrained people (in the realms of kicking martial arts) kicking someone's knees out, so I can understand why it's likely not allowed the overwhelming majority of the time. But if I was sparring someone I knew and we both had full, optimal heavy armor, you better believe I'd ask if kicking was allowed!

[DarthProdigal]

Lol, I'd love to see or participate in that, so post some video when/if it happens. I can't wait to see how the armor looks when you're done with it or with your outfit? I mean I guess it would supersede parts of it or get integrated in? Either way I look forward to seeing it painted/customized and whatnot. You tend to make these seemingly random odds and ends fit together well in general!

[SirLiftaLot]

Lol, I'd love to see or participate in that, so post some video when/if it happens. I can't wait to see how the armor looks when you're done with it or with your outfit? I mean I guess it would supersede parts of it or get integrated in? Either way I look forward to seeing it painted/customized and whatnot. You tend to make these seemingly random odds and ends fit together well in general!

Haha, maybe one day in the future we will be able to spar. But in the meantime, I still need to improve my hamstring flexibility again, or I'll do more injury to myself than my opponent trying to kick!

I suppose I'm going to incorporate the armor into my outfit. The shoulder pads on the one I ordered may be small enough to wear under my grey robe/cardigan, for visual purposes, and so I can drop it to the ground like Obi-Wan did on Mustafar. But if it's too bulky to look good with the cardigan over the armor, then I just won't have it to drop.

And thanks for the compliment. I'll be wearing the new motorcycle armored gloves, and replacing the grey forearm wraps with the black Century forearm and elbow pads. I also imagine that I'll wear the turtleneck compression shirt under the motorcycle armor as opposed to the shirt with the hood, since it's more form-fitting on the arms, and I think that means I'll be able to wear the forearm pads over it. If they're too tight wearing it over the compression shirt, I'll probably have to opt for a sleeveless black compression shirt, which would mean padded shoulders, exposed upper arms to show off the biceps, and the black forearm and elbow pads with the gloves. Pants will be the same, one of the two Thai fisherman pants, and the boots will be the same.

I'll probably have to do something to hide the logo/text on the front band though, since I ordered the motorcycle one with the back pads, not the umpire one without the back pads, although that also has a logo/text that needs to be covered, although that one would definitely be painted if I got it. I suppose I could pretty easily just tape over the logo/text on the belt and maybe put some Star Wars type logo over it. And maybe even still through over it my belt with the saber carabiners, the silver circular buckle, and the pouch. We will see.


The more I look at it, the more I start to see that this armor may not cover my entire front torso with hard armor, while the umpire one would. But we will see. Hopefully the one I ordered will suffice, but if not, the umpire one would be my next option I suppose. Time will tell though. Either way, it will be fun to experiment with, both in terms of form and function. It's a learning and experimenting process to be sure. And seeing how some things work, or some don't, helps my whole look, design, and approach change, which is itself part of the fun I'd say.

[DarthProdigal]

The last picture you posted does look like a IRL version of Episode II or III CloneWars Era Jedi armor (or at least would with a little work). I'd use it for Jedi armor, if I were to make such an outfit. True even if an armor set didn't meet overall needs or you "upgrade" eventually to one with better coverage but in same class you could use it as a backup set for sparring partners, or filming, even base level cosplay option variants for friends. If you emblazoned the shoulders of that last pic style with symbol of the Order it would be a great fit. I also see the limited logos as being easy enough to cover up. Ha, once you finish a full set I might have to call you General at least once, since that seems to be the de facto rank of Jedi commanding Republic troops on battle. (for people that might argue the logic doesn't make sense remember there are often 4 echelons of that rank anyway, with varying degrees of authority so Jedi knight may be 2 star, Master 3 star, High Council Master 4 star) So it denotes their authority to advise/command Republic officers of any rank...  Lmao, GeneralLiftaLot has a ring to it.

[SirLiftaLot]

The last picture you posted does look like a IRL version of Episode II or III CloneWars Era Jedi armor (or at least would with a little work). I'd use it for Jedi armor, if I were to make such an outfit. True even if an armor set didn't meet overall needs or you "upgrade" eventually to one with better coverage but in same class you could use it as a backup set for sparring partners, or filming, even base level cosplay option variants for friends. If you emblazoned the shoulders of that last pic style with symbol of the Order it would be a great fit. I also see the limited logos as being easy enough to cover up. Ha, once you finish a full set I might have to call you General at least once, since that seems to be the de facto rank of Jedi commanding Republic troops on battle. (for people that might argue the logic doesn't make sense remember there are often 4 echelons of that rank anyway, with varying degrees of authority so Jedi knight may be 2 star, Master 3 star, High Council Master 4 star) So it denotes their authority to advise/command Republic officers of any rank...  Lmao, GeneralLiftaLot has a ring to it.

You bring up good points and ideas as usual. I agree that having options and backups is always nice, both for myself and to change based on my needs and mood at the time, and also, as you said, to let friends use it. GeneralLiftaLot does have a nice ring to it.

On a related note, spinning with gloves on was a bit more challenging today. I'm not sure if it's because I took close to a week off, or if it's because I'm sore from my last few workouts, or if it's just I'm trying to go too fast before getting used to the gloves, which is what I think is most likely. I should probably swallow my ego and start slow with the gloves to get a feel for the slight differences and nuance with the gloves, and then build back up speed once I am more used to them.

Of all the spins, the behind the head one seems to be the most challenging at speed with the gloves, so I should probably go back to practicing each spin a series of times, starting slowly, and working back up to speed, and then going back into doing multiple different moves in a series.

I also noticed that if I start with the Obi-Ani spin into the other spins, it really gets a ton of speed going, which is great, but also often leads to me losing control, since it can get to be too fast to smoothly control at this moment. Or sometimes the speed of the spinning out of the Obi-Ani results in my grabbing the staff with the other hand not in the center, which then results in the blade clipping the ground during a spin, which is no bueno. So again, I think it's time to slow it down with the gloves and get a feel for them before going full-speed, and especially before picking up even more speed by starting with the Obi-Ani.

I also think I'm not losing as much speed in the fingerless lifting gloves, and they feel like a middle-ground between none and the motorcycle gloves, but the armored ones offer more protection, and if I'm going to spar eventually, I think getting used to using those would be the best idea, and if I use the other ones, or none, I'll be even faster I suppose.

Quick video with the fingerless gloves:

https://i.imgur.com/XieW9b8.mp4

And two with the full gloves. As you can see, the behind the head spin proves challenging at speeds:

https://i.imgur.com/9mswzLC.mp4

https://i.imgur.com/lCbLOOS.mp4

[SirLiftaLot]

I'm thinking something like this for the motorcycle torso armor I have on the way:



So a sort of grey metal color. And covering up the belt logo/text with a spare Temple Guard logo circle I have from an extra wall mount. Assuming it's the right size, I can just super glue it on the belt I think. If it's too small to cover the entire text, then I'll tape or cover the logo and then put it on I suppose.

[DarthProdigal]

Oh yeah, that'd work brilliantly! That's a pretty cool thing to just have lying around? Especially fitting your color scheme perfectly. Guessing you ordered them to mount your sabers? Good "cannibalization of the spare part" at any rate.

[SirLiftaLot]

Oh yeah, that'd work brilliantly! That's a pretty cool thing to just have lying around? Especially fitting your color scheme perfectly. Guessing you ordered them to mount your sabers? Good "cannibalization of the spare part" at any rate.

I ordered 2, and received 2 (one for each half of the saberstaff). The order was delayed a bit due to the pandemic and holiday rush, but no big deal, I got what I ordered. I did not message the seller or complain or anything like that. And then weeks later, recently, another two show up. So I have two spare ones. Considering I don't plan on buying TWO new lightsabers in the near future, or even one more in the immediate future, I can afford to use 1-2 of them for their parts.

I just measured, and they're 2.25" diameter circles. I don't think that waistband can be more than 3-4", so the size should work, even if I have to cover up the logo underneath regardless.

[DarthProdigal]

The mounts are awesome, I'm trying to visualize what they'd assemble to look like or how a lightsaber gets mounted on that platform. Please let me know when you post a photo of such, I'm intrigued!

[SirLiftaLot]

The mounts are awesome, I'm trying to visualize what they'd assemble to look like or how a lightsaber gets mounted on that platform. Please let me know when you post a photo of such, I'm intrigued!

Thanks! Will do. Not my photos, but photos from the seller's page:

[SirLiftaLot]

Why are some of these umpire chest armor so cool? Are these what MLB umpires are wearing under their shirts/uniforms? I'd take them much more seriously if they were wearing what looked like straight up armor.

Unfortunately this one is $200:


And this one is $120:


But at $40, the one I posted earlier is the steal of the bunch, especially if you're going to paint/customize it anyway. Plus you can pick up a soft-padded abdomen extension for $7 to cover the full torso (not just down to the belly button or bottom of the lowest part of the ribs), and/or additional shoulder extensions (which look like they have hard pads) for $12. But $47 for the torso/shoulder pads and the torso extension sounds like a pretty cool option for anyone interested. Of course, the exact fit and mobility can't really be known until it's worn, since I'd imagine some saber spins and strikes would be different planes of movement than throwing a baseball or doing umpire stuff. Although this may also be applicable for motorcycle armor as well. We will see!

[SirLiftaLot]

Got the forearm and elbow pads. Fit seems good just standing there, will see for spinning. Fit with the gloves seems good too. Cushioning should be adequate enough to not get hurt from medium sparring, but not enough that I'll try to be the Mandalorian and block saber swings with them. I suppose being able to feel hits helps to want to actually avoid getting hit. The inside of the forearms are not padded/covered, but still, most/all places I'm seeing list padded arm gear as optional for medium, so top-of-forearm and elbow pads are definitely better than no pads. Here's some quick photos of the pads with the gloves. Actual outfit photos with them later.