TERMINATOR: DARK FATE - NON-SPOILER REVIEW

[Darth Knox]

PLEASE NOTE - THE FOLLOWING IS A SPOILER FREE REVIEW OF THE MOVIE. I WILL NOT REVEAL ANY MAJOR PLOT POINTS FROM THE MOVIE.

Growing up in the 80s there were three franchises that were immensely popular as they had captured the hearts and minds of audiences: Alien, Predator and Terminator. If you were also a fan of comics you could continue to enjoy stories from these franchises with the excellent stories published by Dark Horse Comics. These stories were dark, gritty, well-written and gripping, and as good as the movies (and even better in some cases).

Time moves on and trends change , but Hollywood still loves money. But, originality is not one of Hollywood’s strong points. This can be seen in their continued attempts to constantly wring every last dollar out of any franchise they can. This means we now live in a world where we have more bad Alien, Predator and Terminator movies than good.

However, where there was once nothing but despair there is now hope. The rights to Terminator are now back in the hands of their creator James Cameron. While he is credited as a producer on this new film, we all know he’s busy with his 17 Avatar sequels. But, at least he is on hand to give input and advice.
Can this movie successfully reboot the Terminator franchise? Will it make us forget the last few abysmal movies? And will the explanation for having Arnie appear make sense or ruin the storytelling?

THE STORY
An aged Sarah Connor and an augmented human from the future must team up to protect a young girl from a new modified liquid Terminator sent to kill her.

OVERALL OPINION
In recent years we have had Deadpool and John Wick very satisfyingly redefine the action movie genre. It should come as no surprise to anyone then that because this movie was directed by one of the directors of Deadpool, it has action. Lots of action. A hell of a lot of action. There is some story in there too, and when the exposition happens it is satisfying and makes sense for the most part. However, the strength of this movie is definitely the action and a lot of very strong performances by virtually everyone involved.

On the surface, it would be fair to say that this pretty much a carbon copy of the first Terminator movie, with a couple of bells and whistles on-top.  But there is a lot more to it than that. There is some real heart here especially from Mackenzie Davies' character and Linda Hamilton.

I'm happy to say that at no point did any thoughts of the movies since T2 pop into my head. The opening of the movie does a great job of bringing us up to speed as to what happened after the end of T2 and where this new movie takes over. And then the action takes over and is well shot and choreographed. Despite there being so many action scenes happening, it all makes sense (the Rev-9 Terminator is an unstoppable killing machine after all). But all the scenes make sense flow well together and you never have a sense of needing a break for a story beat. The Terminator is coming, they need to get away, fight. And that is the fun and beauty of this film.

It is, however, not perfect. If you have seen the trailer then you know Arnie is in this film. And personally, the way the movie explains his presence did seem very far-fetched to me (and this is in a movie with time travel, killer robots and augmented humans). I felt a little out of place with everything that had come before and did slow the momentum a little. However , once Arnie has joined the group and the action starts up again, it did add an interesting new dynamic. And there were a couple of scenes with him that were the funniest thing in the movie. Genuinely laugh out loud funny from the audience I was watching with.

I would be remiss without mentioning the excellent and creative new Terminator. This has been the first time since T2 that I genuinely felt the Terminator as a menacing unstoppable force that will just relentlessly keep coming. The liquid metal over Terminator skeleton presented some great moments and it's hard to see what new threat they will come up with if they do another movie.

How does this movie stack up against the others? It's definitely the best entry in the franchise since T2. It's a little too soon to say if it's a good as it's predecessor, but it's not far off. All in all, a great cinematic experience for lovers of action movies and the Terminator franchise.

THE PERFORMANCES
Linda Hamilton – Sarah Connor
It was a masterstroke bringing Linda Hamilton back to reprise the role of Sarah Connor. There is something very satisfying about seeing her as a grizzled, battle-hardened , grumpy action vet. She is so badass (despite her age).

Mackenzie Davies – Grace
The augmented human sent from the future to protect a young girl, she steals the show in the action stakes. You totally believe her as a soldier with enhanced abilities and she plays off Linda Hamilton really really well. Are we seeing the birth of a new action movie star? Maybe.

Natalia Reyes – Dani Ramos
She's essentially playing the Sarah Connor role from the first movie, but already with a bit of an edge. She more than holds her own against the more experienced actors and is very believable in the couple of big speeches she gives.

Diego Luna – The Terminator
The first thing I saw him in was playing Ghost Rider in Agents of Shield and I thought he was great. He has a very likeable quality about him with laidback charms but always seems to be hiding some darkness too. He is extremely menacing ad this new breed of Terminator, despite the few actual lines of dialogue he gets.

Arnold Schwarzenegger – The (other) Terminator
Very funny in those two scenes I mentioned and gets some badass moments. However honestly, the movie wouldn’t have suffered if he wasn't there. And while Diego Luna felt like a robot you could tell that Arnie was acting like a robot. Not bad and not enough to take you out of the movie, but noticeable enough.

OTHER STUFF
The CGI
It was incredibly well done. Everything from the airplanes to the Terminator itself looked real. There was even a moment at the beginning of the film when we see Sarah Connor from the end of T2. Not sure if it was de-ageing or CGI, but it looked EXACTLY like Linda Hamilton from that earlier movie. No mean feat, considering how wonky the CGI looked in large parts of Gemini Man with Will Smith.

The Action
Action, action and more action. So much action. And great action to boot. Nothing gratuitous or silly. Nothing unbelievable (for this kind of movie). And executed to perfection.

The Pacing
Despite there being so much action, it is actually a remarkably well paced film. It didn't seem like it was over 2 hours, a sign that the action and story were very engrossing.

The Score
On the whole it was good. Some nice uses of the score from the original movie, incorporated at specific times, but quite seamlessly. Only (minor) gripe was the Terminator signature “duh-duh-duh-duh-duh" theme sounded more orchestral without the industrial ironmonger sound. But maybe that's more an issue for me.

FINAL VERDICT
Finally, after waiting 28 years, we have another great Terminator movie. It you like movies with a fairly basic, but interesting, plot that has lots of fantastic action (and a killer robot) then this is the movie for you.

Run time - 2h 14m
Rotten Tomatoes critics score (at time of writing) - 67%

My Score: 8.9/10    
MY MOVIE RATING SYSTEM
10- Citizen F*%king Kane (A+)
 9-  Bloody Great (A)
 8-  Really rather good (A-)
 7-  Pretty decent (B+)
 6-  Definitely above average (B)
 5- Middle of the road average (C)
 4- Mediocre (D)
 3- Meh (E)
 2- Crap (F)
 1- Why the hell did I waste my time and money on this abomination (Unrated)


   

[Darth Logos]

Wow, high praise.

I can't say all the entries since 2 were bad. 3 was a steaming turd, but Salvation and Genesys had some good stuff, despite also having elements that severely detracted.

1) Christian Bale and Bryce Dallas Howard as John and Katherine Conner
2) 2 excellent ideas of Skynet infiltrating the human mind to better infiltrate the resistance.
3) some killer CGI
4) I thought they also had some interesting concepts to evolve the abilities of the 2 classic chassis.

I loved what they did with Byung Hun Lee as a T-1000 in Genesys, though I've never been crazy about the T-1000. Sure it was a phenomenal computer effect in the 90's, and despite baffling me as to how the effect could ever be achieved for well over 20 years , it did make for an excellent villain. But it bypassed the biggest fundamental law of time travel in the Terminator universe: nothing non-living can pass. Unless I'm missing something, the T-1000 is composed entirely of liquid metal (which one would think would need some sort of magnetic field generator to manipulate), so how does it get to the past. The same question also arises in Genesys; how a body made entirely of nano-machines gets a pass through time.

But in Genesys, I also loved how they introduced the concept of an aging terminator: degenerating skin elasticity, reduced muscle mass, protein deficiency in hair color, defective joints. It's got it all. But they also played on the learning computer concept, and despite being an "old, not obsolete" model that is severely outclassed by the younger machines, his extended years in service have also made him more strategic.

Plus the continually running gag of a T-808 trying to smile.




Also her

Mackenzie Davis – Grace

<sighs> I love her eyes. 


Per usual, thank you for a very informative review. -1

[Darth Knox]

I'll agree that Arnie was one of the funniest things in Genisys. But, I disagree with what you said about both Salvation & Genisys. But, of course, that is just my opinion. I know I'm in the minority. I just didn't enjoy those movies at all ( I think I did a non-spoiler review of Genisys on the forum and wasn't very kind if memory serves).

Also, at the time, I hadn't seen Game of Thrones, so didn't know what Emilia Clarke was like as an actress. And to be honest, I wasn't very impressed with her in Genisys. But again, just my opinion. Not trying to convince anyone to believe differently.

[Darth Logos]

I'll agree that Arnie was one of the funniest things in Genisys. But, I disagree with what you said about both Salvation & Genisys. But, of course, that is just my opinion. I know I'm in the minority. I just didn't enjoy those movies at all ( I think I did a non-spoiler review of Genisys on the forum and wasn't very kind if memory serves).

Also, at the time, I hadn't seen Game of Thrones, so didn't know what Emilia Clarke was like as an actress. And to be honest, I wasn't very impressed with her in Genisys. But again, just my opinion. Not trying to convince anyone to believe differently.

Yeah, meant to say: had good ideas but overall were poorly executed.

I just love looking at her. But as we have seen time and time again; good actors can trump bad writing, but not bad direction.

Also, Diego Luna was French resistance dude from Rogue One.  Might want a mod to fix your cast to Gabriel Luna.

[Bob Loblaw]

Yeah, meant to say: had good ideas but overall were poorly executed.

I just love looking at her. But as we have seen time and time again; good actors can trump bad writing, but not bad direction.

Also, Diego Luna was French resistance dude from Rogue One.  Might want a mod to fix your cast to Gabriel Luna.

I'm just curious, where do you get French anything from Diego Luna? I might be missing something. There are no French people in the Star Wars Universe, and Diego Luna is Mexican. I'm confused.

[Darth Knox]

Also, Diego Luna was French resistance dude from Rogue One.  Might want a mod to fix your cast to Gabriel Luna.

Oops. Thanks for that.

I just love looking at her. But as we have seen time and time again; good actors can trump bad writing, but not bad direction.

She is beautiful, but whenever I see her in interviews she reminds me of a Thunderbirds puppet (and now I have forever ruined Emillia Clarke for everyone! 🤣🤣🤣)

Yeah, meant to say: had good ideas but overall were poorly executed.

There were one or two good ideas. Just a shame they never decided to use the Dark Horse comics as a basis for any of the movies. I have them all and they were spectacular.

[Darth Logos]

I'm just curious, where do you get French anything from Diego Luna? I might be missing something. There are no French people in the Star Wars Universe, and Diego Luna is Mexican. I'm confused.

1) I said "French resistance dude" not French dude. Andor just struck me as very WWII French resistance.

2) Max von Sydow (born April 10, 1929) is a Swedish–French actor who stars in Star Wars: Episode VII The Force Awakens as Lor San Tekka.
BOOM

She is beautiful, but whenever I see her in interviews she reminds me of a Thunderbirds puppet (and now I have forever ruined Emillia Clarke for everyone! 🤣🤣🤣)

I also like that she just comes off as real people. But I really only remember seeing her on Graham Norton, and most everyone on that's on that show comes off as real people.

There were one or two good ideas. Just a shame they never decided to use the Dark Horse comics as a basis for any of the movies. I have them all and they were spectacular.

Yeah. I still watch them. Shocking I know; that there are some movies I can sit back and enjoy despite not making a terrible lot of sense.

[Bob Loblaw]

1) I said "French resistance dude" not French dude. Andor just struck me as very WWII French resistance.

Thanks for clearing that up. WWII French resistance. That''s what I missed.

2) Max von Sydow (born April 10, 1929) is a Swedish–French actor who stars in Star Wars: Episode VII The Force Awakens as Lor San Tekka.
BOOM

I meant in universe. Just as there are no British people IN the Star Wars UNIVERSE. Actors? Obviously.

Sorry, Knox. I forgot to thank you for another excellent review. -1

[Darth Logos]

Thanks for clearing that up. WWII French resistance. That''s what I missed.

I meant in universe. Just as there are no British people IN the Star Wars UNIVERSE. Actors? Obviously.

Responding in Random SW Thoughts

[Darth Knox]

Sorry, Knox. I forgot to thank you for another excellent review. -1

Thanks

I also like that she just comes off as real people. But I really only remember seeing her on Graham Norton, and most everyone on that's on that show comes off as real people.

Oh, she is incredibly down to earth and real. She still reminds me of a Thunderbirds puppet. And point for watching Graham Norton (love him).

Yeah. I still watch them. Shocking I know; that there are some movies I can sit back and enjoy despite not making a terrible lot of sense.

There are plenty of bad movies that I love and will defend to the death (Flash Gordon, Star Trek V: The Final Frontier).

[Infinit01]

My apologies that it took so long for me to respond to this. As per our discussion with the many trailers, I was really open-minded to this movie and was finally able to watch it.  The stories from the 90s and older had a lot of good content that went with the movie which was what I loved. I watched the first Terminator and there's something raw about the story where the father of the leader of the resistance group that took down an artificial intelligence who just about destroyed mankind with its killer exoskeleton robots, planes, and vehicles.

That was my favorite movie of the 80s and then T2 arrived in 91 which blew me away with the storyline and new Terminator that was virtually indestructible due to having no chassis to catch bullets and grenades. As a kid, I would live in the movie from beginning to end and love the length of this movie, even more so with the extended version.

Now, Dark Fate like Knox as mentioned is pretty much like a re-do of the first and second movies. I say second because there are quite a bit of scene that pays homage to both movies almost mimicking some. I disagree with some story arc; however, seeing that there would be another story, I can see why this route was taken.


I'm so glad that Linda Hamilton returned to reprise her role as Sarah Conner. Did you know that she passed up T3 because at the time she felt that the story of Sarah Conner was at an end after T2 which was why her story was that she died of cancer?

Speaking of a Conner, I leave it at bringing their story to an end, a sad but a good one is all I'm going to say. If you want to know what I'm talking about, message me.

To answer Know, it was CGI de-aging for all characters from T2, really good CGI de-aging used by Marvel as well.

To me, this action is like Deadpool's action in that you can follow it unlike Michael Bay's where it's just ADHD going on.  The CGI is really good and really made me think about T2's CGI that was good for its time.

From beginning to end, I didn't feel like a lot of time has past but it did which means that I enjoyed the movie and love it. The pacing just like Knox mentioned is great. You know what part of the story you're in and aren't questioning much.

For my closing thoughts, This is a movie I've been waiting for since T2 back in 1991 and although I enjoyed the last three Terminators in different ways, this is the movie that should of been but I'm kind of glad that it arrived this year since all the acting, cast, and action wouldn't of been the same.

[Darth Knox]

Unfortunately it seems like this movie is going to go a massive financial flop. It cost $155 million but only made $29 million opening weekend (and barely over $100 million worldwide). That's lower than Genisys made. It seems to well liked by audiences and critics on Rotten Tomatoes, but reports are that when you figure in marketing costs, the movie will loss the studio about $120 million, unless it has really good legs at the box office. It seems that for vast amount of people, The Terminator just isn't a popular franchise anymore.

[Infinit01]

Unfortunately it seems like this movie is going to go a massive financial flop. It cost $155 million but only made $29 million opening weekend (and barely over $100 million worldwide). That's lower than Genisys made. It seems to well liked by audiences and critics on Rotten Tomatoes, but reports are that when you figure in marketing costs, the movie will loss the studio about $120 million, unless it has really good legs at the box office. It seems that for vast amount of people, The Terminator just isn't a popular franchise anymore.

Yeah, I saw that the other day, really bad for a debut weekend.   To me, a lot of people get into things when they become popular, following the mass if you will. Terminator isn't popular so only fans like us will watch it. It's a shame though, this may be the end of the franchise which I hope it doesn't. I've read all the books from T1 until now and there's some books in between the films. Lots of stories for it

Consider this, T2 is the highest grossing film in the franchise (obviously), grossed $204.8 million in North America and another $517 million with a budget of $90 to $102 million. Terminator Genisys and T3, are second third place with Genisys grossing $440.6 ($155 million budget), and Rise of the Machines grossing $433.4 million ($187.3 budget). Salvation is in fourth place with $371.4 million and The Terminator at $78.3 million ($6.4 million budget).

Terminator Dark Fate had a budget of $185 to $196 million

[Darth Knox]

Yeah, I saw that the other day, really bad for a debut weekend.   To me, a lot of people get into things when they become popular, following the mass if you will. Terminator isn't popular so only fans like us will watch it. It's a shame though, this may be the end of the franchise which I hope it doesn't. I've read all the books from T1 until now and there's some books in between the films. Lots of stories for it

Consider this, T2 is the highest grossing film in the franchise (obviously), grossed $204.8 million in North America and another $517 million with a budget of $90 to $102 million. Terminator Genisys and T3, are second third place with Genisys grossing $440.6 ($155 million budget), and Rise of the Machines grossing $433.4 million ($187.3 budget). Salvation is in fourth place with $371.4 million and The Terminator at $78.3 million ($6.4 million budget).

Terminator Dark Fate had a budget of $185 to $196 million

I think the problem is, fans of the franchise have, for the most part, not enjoyed Rise, Salvation or Genisys. So it's a case of fool me once, fool me twice. Also, the younger generation don't have the same connection to the franchise or the same love as they more than likely grew up with Rise, Salvation and Genisys. Also, apart from Salvation, all the movies are the same basic plot: sentient machines send a killer robot back in time to kill an important leader. Humans send back a protector. Fight! Kind of repetitive, even when you have a movie like Dark Fate that has some fantastic action.

[Darth Logos]

I think the problem is, fans of the franchise have, for the most part, not enjoyed Rise, Salvation or Genisys. So it's a case of fool me once, fool me twice. Also, the younger generation don't have the same connection to the franchise or the same love as they more than likely grew up with Rise, Salvation and Genisys. Also, apart from Salvation, all the movies are the same basic plot: sentient machines send a killer robot back in time to kill an important leader. Humans send back a protector. Fight! Kind of repetitive, even when you have a movie like Dark Fate that has some fantastic action.

This is why I enjoyed Salvation: it wasn't a time travel piece. It was simply good guys versus bad guys in the "present" (which is OUR future). What I liked even more about it was the nature of Skynet. It wasn't just a simple machine with a flawed logic.....it was learning. It was capable of baiting the humans; making sacrifice maneuvers in order to achieve greater victory.