Should we establish light saber martial styles?

[Master Uilos]

I think Form I is the easiest to find a real-world equivelant to. It's the starting point of every martial art involving blades. Form V is also pretty straightforward. I would say that the hardest to find an equivelant to would be Form IV. Not many people are capable of focusing on speed and completely on offense (at least not for more than a little while), so it would be pretty tough to find any martial art that involves losing energy that fast on purpose. Ninjutsu is probably the closest, just take out the defense.
That can be taken so many ways....

There's been a kata based on Shii Cho/Form I for a few years

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgRXnZw-uq0" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgRXnZw-uq0</a>

(after that it's my ugly, ugly version of Form V, and you should stop watching after 56 seconds.) Best part? It works.  It really works as a sword form. Here is the kata's creator, Damon Honeycutt/General Sun, explaining how it works in practice. Keep in mind, adept in Monkey Style Kung Fu, he knows his stuff.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0OLlYLB2fA" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0OLlYLB2fA</a>

Ataru/Form IV''s closest equivalent in my mind would be Tien/Chinese Straight Sword and Dao/Chinese Broadsword. Essentially: Wushu. Here's an example:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4y4SpqKPm7U" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4y4SpqKPm7U</a>

Also, I think Juyo/Form VII would be the most difficult, simply on the fact that Ataru focuses on attacks, but Juyo had nothig but attacks. There was no concept of defensive measures.

[Luna]

Awesome videos! You get a point The Ataru was a lot more.... fluid.... than what I've seen

[Master Uilos]

Awesome videos! You get a point The Ataru was a lot more.... fluid.... than what I've seen

That was something I noted in it's description. Ataru was speed and agility with Continuity, each move chained to the next.

[Master Rel]

I've been trying to find a real-world martial arts equivalent to Ataru, but I am at a loss. Any ideas?

How about WuShu?

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-1gSD2_nxI" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-1gSD2_nxI</a>

[Luna]

Wushu definitely seems like Ataru in many ways. Uilos718 mentioned it in relation to the Ataru video he posted, and I agree. I'm sure it would borrow elements from other martials arts like ninjutsu, too.

[Master Rel]

Actual Ninjutsu compared to theatrical Ninjutsu is like most martial styles under the same spotlight...night and day.

The modern ninja should still be a practitioner of the silent treatment...disguise, camouflage, traps, spying, etc.

The movie version is really really cool and fun fun fun, but so very specialized.

Name dropping yes, but I took a seminar with Stephen Hayes in 1986 at Camp Lejeune NC...it was quite interesting but I can promise you that the actual modern ninja profile is quite different than you would think.

Movie version ninjas have more in common with parkour





...and good parkour is a glorious thing to watch; I am a huge fan of all aspects of parkour...beyond me at this point...but I am a fan...

[Luna]

So real ninjutsu would be more along the lines of Trakata - tricks and such (assuming there is more to Trakata than the lightsaber deactivation trick, as Wookieepedia hints at).

[Master Rel]

So real ninjutsu would be more along the lines of Trakata - tricks and such (assuming there is more to Trakata than the lightsaber deactivation trick, as Wookieepedia hints at).

That seems quite reasonable. 

If there were ninja types and I am certain there are in the Star Wars universe they would certainly use the Trakata on/off trick...maybe even trying to turn the opponent's saber off also 

As far as real world techniques which is what this thread was intended for, the on and off would be a tough one to simulate.

But the idea of using tricks would be interesting to consider...trips, leg sweeps, weight shifting, etc.

[Luna]

As far as real world techniques which is what this thread was intended for, the on and off would be a tough one to simulate.

Completely relaxing your wrist when the blades are locked would probably accomplish the same thing, but Passing the Blade would be impossible. Unless you were using one of the extendable Hasbro sabers and stopped, put the blade back in, and flicked it out again

[Jammo]

About real application of trakata style techniques I will share this tale from the back yard... I was using a reverse grip style against my brother and was taking harder swings than usual to set him up for what I ended up doing. I needed to set him for hard parries, see, and in one of my passes I took a pretty obvious wind up to come in for a heavy shot. The idea that I was trying to instill in him is that I was trying to move his blade physically to make my opening, but it was all a lie... I was trying to move his blade MENTALLY to make my opening. When he moved to a hard parry position with the intent to make a slide counter attack when he stopped my blade, I rotated my wrist 90 degrees to point my blade directly downward just long enough to pass by his blade. I then moved in behind his hands with all of his energy moving away from my new orientation and tapped his hilt right on the blade holder (Sun Djem in your marks of contact), safely ending the encounter with no damage to either party. I felt good about that duel.

[Master Nero Attoru]

About real application of trakata style techniques I will share this tale from the back yard... I was using a reverse grip style against my brother and was taking harder swings than usual to set him up for what I ended up doing. I needed to set him for hard parries, see, and in one of my passes I took a pretty obvious wind up to come in for a heavy shot. The idea that I was trying to instill in him is that I was trying to move his blade physically to make my opening, but it was all a lie... I was trying to move his blade MENTALLY to make my opening. When he moved to a hard parry position with the intent to make a slide counter attack when he stopped my blade, I rotated my wrist 90 degrees to point my blade directly downward just long enough to pass by his blade. I then moved in behind his hands with all of his energy moving away from my new orientation and tapped his hilt right on the blade holder (Sun Djem in your marks of contact), safely ending the encounter with no damage to either party. I felt good about that duel.

That sounds like an awesome duel.

These ideas remind me of a fencing disengage, which I sometimes use in my dueling.  You essentially feint towards a specific area, then when the opponent moves to parry you alter your attack subtly to strike a different area.  It's not exactly the same thing as Trakata, but it has the same concept:  sneaking past the opponent's guard through deception.

[Darth Unobtanium]

When it comes to dueling, I'm self-taught. I'm not sure I can really place my techniques  into any one style. I'd love to learn some actual, formal techniques, and I'm also planning to practice Niten Ichi-Ryu.

Man, I love lightsaber combat. It's just unlike anything else out there.

[Luna]

I was just thinking - perhaps Systema blade techniques would be similar to what we call Form V? I'm no martial arts expert, but Stingie showed me some basic techniques when she was over here and I've done a bit of research since, and it reminded me of my perception of Form V.

[SOTJ]

I was just thinking - perhaps Systema blade techniques would be similar to what we call Form V? I'm no martial arts expert, but Stingie showed me some basic techniques when she was over here and I've done a bit of research since, and it reminded me of my perception of Form V.

Maybe so. I can't find any videos of Systema blade training, although she did show you some of the hand-to-hand techniques. Anyone else here have Systema training?

[Master Uilos]

I was just thinking - perhaps Systema blade techniques would be similar to what we call Form V? I'm no martial arts expert, but Stingie showed me some basic techniques when she was over here and I've done a bit of research since, and it reminded me of my perception of Form V.

I would agree that systema would be a good example of Form V. Alot of it is point/counterpoint, relying on the opponent to attack first and reply in kind. However, the same goes for a lot of "soft style" martial arts like JiuJitsu, Aikido, Sambo, Ba Gua and a few others. One member of NYJ is a practitioner of Systema (he's a practitioner of a lot of styles, but he teaches us Systema) and I (who study Goshin Ryu JiuJitsu) have shown just how ugly a fight would be between the two. Put a weapon in one or boths hands and you get creative, put a single blade in the middle of the floor between the two and you pray your insurance is paid up. Their soft, not merciful. Any attack given them is essentially a kamikaze attack, you had better go in knowing that what goes in may not be coming back out /endgleefuljiujisturant

I would put Systema on the "Shien" side of Form V, because it does incorporate more fluid movements than Djem So's description seems to allow.