Random Star Wars Thoughts

[ed_ification]

Nahh, technicalities count.  I learned that taking the Purity Test back in the '80s.

As Futurama taught us, technically correct is the best kind of correct.

[Darth Logos]

Nahh, technicalities count.  I learned that taking the Purity Test back in the '80s.

If I'm not mistaken, a desert is classified by a lack of precipitation/water, not heat. So if there is snow and ice then the region is Tundra, not desert.


And after an extensive 5 minutes of searching on Google, here is the answer.

https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-a-cold-desert-and-a-tundra

[Cyclops942]

If I'm not mistaken, a desert is classified by a lack of precipitation/water, not heat. So if there is snow and ice then the region is Tundra, not desert.


And after an extensive 5 minutes of searching on Google, here is the answer.

https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-a-cold-desert-and-a-tundra

Again, technicalities count.

[Darth Tepes]

Speaking of Deserts...... If tattoine were to lose one of its suns (and not be destroyed in the process) how long would you figure it would take for the Planet to change....

[Cyclops942]

Speaking of Deserts...... If tattoine were to lose one of its suns (and not be destroyed in the process) how long would you figure it would take for the Planet to change....

I would think some changes would be immediate, but I also think that changes would increase in intensity over time, until equilibrium was obtained.  And to come up with SOME answer to the question I think you were asking, I have no idea how long it would take to reach this equilibrium point, but I'd guess it wouldn't be quick.

[Darth Logos]

Again, technicalities count.

Speaking of Deserts...... If tattoine were to lose one of its suns (and not be destroyed in the process) how long would you figure it would take for the Planet to change....

It's an interesting question: what happens in a binary system if/when one star goes? Plus, by the looks of it, Tatooine is either distant from the system center, or the binary stars are small. The latter makes me think that their combined gravity is similar to our sun. The prior makes me think that the stars are much larger, and thus even at its orbit, Tatooine still gets plenty of heat and light. In either case, loss of one sun would result in the planetary orbit destabilizing.

Fun fact: Beyond our asteroid belt, the sun is visibly indistinguishable from any other star.

[PsychoSith]

Speaking of Deserts...... If tattoine were to lose one of its suns (and not be destroyed in the process) how long would you figure it would take for the Planet to change....

So answer here is horrifically complex.

The answer to your question depends on the following (yes im going for realism here and ima gonna nitpick a little)
1) Tatooine's weather patterns and seasons
2) Orbit of Tatooine and how it relates to the stars
3) The surviving star's luminosity, distance, density, flare activity, and orbital changes without its' twin.
4) The erased star's luminosity, distance, density, flare activity
5) Tatooine's rotation (which could be changed depending on which star winks out)
6) Is the star still there? (IE did it turn into a black dwarf, supernova, winks out of existence...etc)
7) Tatooine's geothermal activity
8 ) Tatooine's atmospheric composition


Im sure i missed a lot but this is a real complex question. Some changes such as average temperature can change in as little as a few minutes depending on the light distance from the mentioned star (Earth - Sol is approx. 8 light-minutes apart and thus if the sun disappeared we would still bask in normal light & heat for 8 minutes after the fact) but other changes like the orbital catastrophe this would inevitably cause would take awhile.

[Darth Logos]

So answer here is horrifically complex.

The answer to your question depends on the following (yes im going for realism here and ima gonna nitpick a little)
1) Tatooine's weather patterns and seasons
2) Orbit of Tatooine and how it relates to the stars
3) The surviving star's luminosity, distance, density, flare activity, and orbital changes without its' twin.
4) The erased star's luminosity, distance, density, flare activity
5) Tatooine's rotation (which could be changed depending on which star winks out)
6) Is the star still there? (IE did it turn into a black dwarf, supernova, winks out of existence...etc)
7) Tatooine's geothermal activity
8 ) Tatooine's atmospheric composition


Im sure i missed a lot but this is a real complex question. Some changes such as average temperature can change in as little as a few minutes depending on the light distance from the mentioned star (Earth - Sol is approx. 8 light-minutes apart and thus if the sun disappeared we would still bask in normal light & heat for 8 minutes after the fact) but other changes like the orbital catastrophe this would inevitably cause would take awhile.

Points for realism.

I would consider 8 min pretty immediate. Also, without the gravity well, there is nothing to counteract the planet from moving in a linear trajectory. I'm not entirely sure how/if this would be felt in the earth's surface. But it would get dark and cold very fast. Best guess, earth would be dead within a week if the sun got oopsed.

[Cyclops942]

Again, technicalities count.

You simply refuse to admit when you're wrong, don't you?  Well, wrong or not, nobody can call you a quitter.

[Infinit01]

You simply refuse to admit when you're wrong, don't you?  Well, wrong or not, nobody can call you a quitter.

This and point incoming

[Darth Logos]

You simply refuse to admit when you're wrong, don't you?  Well, wrong or not, nobody can call you a quitter.

It's more just an excuse to quote Dr. Cox.

But I still stand that although both regions may have similar qualities, the primary difference between them is the amount of water. One would hardly classify Hoth as a desert planet.

[Cyclops942]

But I still stand that although both regions may have similar qualities, the primary difference between them is the amount of water. One would hardly classify Hoth as a desert planet.

To be fair, we don't know if there is much precipitation on Hoth; we saw it for about one day.  It might have lots of precipitation, or that snow we see blowing around at night might have been only blowing snow, not new snowfall.  As a result, it's difficult to argue for it being called a desert planet in general.

However, to keep beating a dead horse (because why not), let's assume that the vast majority of Hoth has less than the requisite 10" (25.4cm) of average annual precipitation, and the ice and snow that we do see is the result of years, decades, centuries, or millennia of accumulation, just to make it technically possible that it is both an ice planet (as it is called in-canon) and a desert planet.

I think that, to your point (or at least what I think is your point), Logos, most everybody is going to call it "the ice planet Hoth" rather than "the freezing-cold, ice-covered desert planet Hoth."  Yes, it would be a desert planet, but in common parlance, it's going to be known as an ice planet.

Now... is everyone happy satisfied?

[Darth Logos]

To be fair, we don't know if there is much precipitation on Hoth; we saw it for about one day.  It might have lots of precipitation, or that snow we see blowing around at night might have been only blowing snow, not new snowfall.  As a result, it's difficult to argue for it being called a desert planet in general.

However, to keep beating a dead horse (because why not), let's assume that the vast majority of Hoth has less than the requisite 10" (25.4cm) of average annual precipitation, and the ice and snow that we do see is the result of years, decades, centuries, or millennia of accumulation, just to make it technically possible that it is both an ice planet (as it is called in-canon) and a desert planet.

I think that, to your point (or at least what I think is your point), Logos, most everybody is going to call it "the ice planet Hoth" rather than "the freezing-cold, ice-covered desert planet Hoth."  Yes, it would be a desert planet, but in common parlance, it's going to be known as an ice planet.

Now... is everyone happy satisfied?

HEY! If Rocky can punch up a side of beef, we can beat on a dead horse.

I changed my wording to 'water'. Snow and ice = water. Deserts are defined by their lack of water. Going off of that criteria, Hoth has more in common with Kamino than Tatooine in that it is covered in snow and ice (at least in cinematic depiction; we don't see the entire global climate). Plus we have already seen it snowing....a LOT on Hoth. It was 2 days at least. First day: when Luke gets lost and found. Second day: when Han and Chewie go droid hunting. And I can't really remember if it was snowing after the battle. And one could hardly argue that Luke was fighting fit after only a few hours in a bacta tank, and the opening chapter of ESB took place in a day and a half. But we can argue about the chronology later.

[Cyclops942]

HEY! If Rocky can punch up a side of beef, we can beat on a dead horse.

I changed my wording to 'water'. Snow and ice = water. Deserts are defined by their lack of water. Going off of that criteria, Hoth has more in common with Kamino than Tatooine in that it is covered in snow and ice (at least in cinematic depiction; we don't see the entire global climate). Plus we have already seen it snowing....a LOT on Hoth. It was 2 days at least. First day: when Luke gets lost and found. Second day: when Han and Chewie go droid hunting. And I can't really remember if it was snowing after the battle. And one could hardly argue that Luke was fighting fit after only a few hours in a bacta tank, and the opening chapter of ESB took place in a day and a half. But we can argue about the chronology later.
[/quote
Considering the the #2 definition of desert (according to Merriam-Webster) is "an area of water apparently devoid of life," I'm going to have to call foul on this.

The #1 definition at that same source is "arid land with usually sparse vegetation (especially: such land having a very warm climate and receiving less than 25 cm (10 inches) of sporadic rainfall annually)."  The primary definition is that it's dry.  (Arid is defined as "excessively dry, specifically : having insufficient rainfall to support agriculture")  This would qualify Hoth as a desert planet, because the "especially" part is not the main definition, it is a special case (hence the "especially" part), albeit a very common one.

I'll give you the longer stay on the healing period, but we still saw only the one snowstorm, and it takes a LOT of snowfall to add up to even one inch of rainfall, so that is inconclusive.  We don't even know how much of that storm was blowing snow that was already on the ground, and how much was new accumulation.

I still say that Hoth could be technically a desert planet, but from what we've seen of it, most folks would still call it an ice planet.

I am officially done beating this poor equine, so you can have the last word, Logos.  I will try REALLY hard not to comment any more on this topic, because I'm getting worn out just thinking about it, and I can only imagine what it's like for everyone but you and me to read this.

To everyone who had to read this and doesn't care, I apologize.

[TheDutchman]

To everyone who had to read this and doesn't care, I apologize.

Not at all Cyclops!

I, for one, love the discourse   

Besides, we're Star Wars fans; we collectively LOVE to argue ad nauseam on topics   










...And Hoth would be classified as a cold desert IMO 

Points for Logos and Cyclops for not only presenting their respective opinions as well as beating the horse to death, life, redeath, undeath, and beyond