Dual Weilding Saber Staffs

[Master Lucien Kane]

How about one saber and one staff? Or, perhaps, if one shortened the staff hilts to a standard lightsaber hilt size and adjusted the blade lengths to 32 or 30 inches each?

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkQsdqrxfek" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkQsdqrxfek</a>

[Airk Tobruk]

Excellent Master Kane!  Have you ever applied those techniques against an opponent and if so, how was your experience?

[Master Lucien Kane]

Excellent Master Kane!  Have you ever applied those techniques against an opponent and if so, how was your experience?

It feels a little over whelming against one opponent for me. I liked it more against multiple opponents.

That being said it takes a lot of practice, and even I smacked myself in the head a couple times getting this video done lol

[Volund Starfire]

What about, rather than saber staffs with full length blades, use a shoto-length blade?

[Krace]

What about, rather than saber staffs with full length blades, use a shoto-length blade?

Well, I know a lot of people use 32" blades for saber staffs because it makes them more manageable.  I imagine you could use a couple 24" blades to make them even easier to wield.  The problem is you start giving up blade length and reach against your opponents.  While having 2 saber staffs would make you dangerous to approach, somebody who had a full 36" blade or even a 40" could probably get inside your defenses if you weren't careful.

[Volund Starfire]

Well, I know a lot of people use 32" blades for saber staffs because it makes them more manageable.  I imagine you could use a couple 24" blades to make them even easier to wield.  The problem is you start giving up blade length and reach against your opponents.  While having 2 saber staffs would make you dangerous to approach, somebody who had a full 36" blade or even a 40" could probably get inside your defenses if you weren't careful.

Not necessarily.  Jo forms are often better than Bo forms because the staff is a more manageable length.  Also, it would entirely depend on the skill of the person using the shoto-double saber as compared to the person using the standard saber.

[WookieeGunner]

Well, I know a lot of people use 32" blades for saber staffs because it makes them more manageable.  I imagine you could use a couple 24" blades to make them even easier to wield.  The problem is you start giving up blade length and reach against your opponents.  While having 2 saber staffs would make you dangerous to approach, somebody who had a full 36" blade or even a 40" could probably get inside your defenses if you weren't careful.

Actually, it is easier for a person with a short blade to get inside the defense of a person with a longer blade than the other way around.  When you are fighting someone with a long blade, you actually have a sweet spot that is inside their combat range.  The trick is that you have to go through their sweet spot to get there, but there are a lot of tricks to making that happen.

[Oramac]

Not necessarily.  Jo forms are often better than Bo forms because the staff is a more manageable length.  Also, it would entirely depend on the skill of the person using the shoto-double saber as compared to the person using the standard saber.

The major difference being, with any current (non-lightsaber) staff technique, you can grab any part of the staff you want.   With a saberstaff you must grab only the middle of the staff. 

[XtheXcodeX]

in theory, yes. it would be a very powerful combination. in reality, it could, but it would require years of working with staffs one-handed and a near perfectly centered center of gravity (meaning the staff is held right in the middle, with both sides the same length). so, unless you mastered staffs, you can try, but it would be extremely difficult.

[Deceptae]

i could see myself doing staff and saber but double staff would really just get me killed.
keep in mind i am 5 foot 9 and Abe Linkin built.

1. blocking with one hand is only feasible with Makashi style which is impossible with a back blade.

2. blocking with the back blade is tantamount to using reverse grip, which i avoid even when dual wielding.

3. the only other "feasible" one hand block i can think of for staff is Soresu which requires such technique that you would be hard-pressed to avoid killing yourself or your sabers, let alone keeping up with your opponents.

so yeah, effective defense against bladed weapons would be nigh on impossible unless you are very phisically strong and have excellent multitasking abilities.

staff and saber would be (slightly yet remarkably) more manageable because you could use the saber to cover the areas left vulnerable by your staff's back blade and hilt, reinforse blocks by your staff or even use it for your primary defense with your staff as backup.

offence would be a (relative) breeze as you have lots of glowing sticks with which to distract opponents while the real attack slips in unnoticed. plus even if you want to move the staff arround freely without hurting yourself or your weapons you can just tuck your single saber behind your back Ataru style and spin to your heart's content.

at least that is what i would think. questions and thoughts welcome.

[Xaeyon]

It's all very well to be flashy and showy attempting the dual-wielding thing but biomechanically in a realistic situation it is flawed to the point of ridicule.

A staff is very hard to accelerate with one hand as the point of torque is inside the span of your hand; and compare this to the rest of the staff. The inertia of the whole thing will make it slow to build up any speed (and for those of you who say, no I can do it quickly, accelerating a staff with two hands or a sword with one is much, MUCH quicker).

Now consider you hit something: there is a saying that if you want to strike (punch) something, aim six inches behind it; without proper leverage there is no power behind a strike to direct the force six inches through it. AND that is assuming the jolt of striking a target doesn't blow the staff out of your grip; if there is a solid connection with a target or block, the shock running through the staff will cause it to weaken your grip. Even if you don't lose it, you'll have lost all the momentum you had to build up to make the strike and now you're back to square one. You would be completely vulnerable to counterattack.

[Master Lucien Kane]

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzU68DEPw1w" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzU68DEPw1w</a>

This is the behind the scenes motion capture for the Return Cinematic Trailer... This is where we see a Jedi Master Dual wield a Saber and a double bladed saber. If you notice the weapons they're using are foam and much lighter than the staffs we're using, also I believe at points they are actually shorter. Also this is highly choreographed.

Is it do-able... certainly... is it practical... Not really.

[Krace]

Ok, that was pretty sweet seeing the behind scenes.  So, three things to keep in mind when we talk about dual wielding these things.

1.  REAL lightsabers only have weight in the handle, the blade weighs nothing and only needs force behind it to cut through through things
2.  Jedi/Sith use the Force to imbue themselves with A. strength and agility beyond that of a normal human, and B. use it to skillfully guide their lightsabers
3.  This guy was a Jedi MASTER, not just a Knight or something.  He's had a lifetime of using these weapons.  Also, he only uses the second blade on the double-blade for a short period, about 30 seconds.  Then he switches it off and only uses it again for a surprise gut stab on the one Sith.

[Oramac]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzU68DEPw1w#ws

This is the behind the scenes motion capture for the Return Cinematic Trailer... This is where we see a Jedi Master Dual wield a Saber and a double bladed saber. If you notice the weapons they're using are foam and much lighter than the staffs we're using, also I believe at points they are actually shorter. Also this is highly choreographed.

Is it do-able... certainly... is it practical... Not really.

Can;t see the video at work, but one other thing to remember is that during almost all of they fight, he had the reverse blade of the staff turned off.  He only turned it on to get through the Sith's defenses. 

[haldir]

Those old republic videos are blowing my mind!

One thing to remember, in Star Wars, the blades have no weight. Double staff wielding in the Star Wars universe is prob much more of a mental/ force skill rather that strength