Jedi Academy: Tython

[Darth Logos]

In the original canon, Luke made a synthetic crystal. I believe he used a furnace at Obi-Wan's home.

Now, though, there is no such thing as a synthetic crystal, as I'm sure you know.

So then how did Luke get his green cryatal? Like I said, it just opens up new questions without sufficiently wrapping up the old ones.

It makes sense, since the Empire made owning a lightsaber illegal, and I believe they cordoned of any planet capable of producing saber crystals. Luke would have no other option in obtaining a crystal other than forging one.

I refuse to accept this. Is Disney actually putting effort behind making Star Wars suck? It's like "all the good ideas were already used and we threw them out as "Legends", so now let's just use the worst ideas imaginable just so we can say we're original."

I know this may be a "lazy" suggestion but I did read somewhere that Obi-Wan liked to modify and improve his saber over time (in real life this was used to explain the differences between the props used in the films). Possibly Kenobi had another crystal that hadn't been meditated on that Luke used.
Then there are the rumours that the green crystal came from Qui-gon's hilt which Kenobi kept after TPM but on StarWars.com it says Qui-gon's saber was later kept at the Jedi Temple in a memorial to Jinn but after Order 66 who knows.

I am probably wrong, I'm struggling to know anything for sure now.

Theories are nice, but I'd rather have an official story. Unfortunately, some bone-head tossed it out.

Heir to the Jedi, Luke is given a Rodian Jedi's lightsaber (which has a purple blade), but he managed to damaged it while trying to figure out how it works.  I don't know if he kept the crystal, but that could be used as the source for his later green bladed weapon.  The color changing to reflect whatever he was meditating on as he built it.

We can guess that Ezra is using the same crystal he got on Lothal, and that the blade color changed for some reason when he built his second lightsaber.

Ahsoka's shota blade is a yellowish-green rather than green like her main blade.  The producers said they tried to push that blade as close to yellow as they could get away with at that time while still under Lucas.

If don't know why blade are certain colors.  An old theory was that Windu's blade was purple because it was a mix of red and blue to show how close to the dark side is fighting style was.   However there is the alternate explaination that the colors are an EM spectrum representation of the Force Light Side and Dark Side range.    Blue seems to be very common with Jedi with Green being rarer.  Red seems to be for all the dark siders presently (I have yet to find a dark sider in the current canon that has as lightsaber they built post-fall that is not red).  On the EM spectrum, Violet is on one end and Red is on the other, with yellow and green in the middle.  Because blue seem to be the common Jedi color, perhaps that is the standard wavelength of the Light Side.  Green is a bit darker in thought, though Anakin's blade is still blue, though more Cyan than his first one. Luke's saber is green when he is full or questions and has doubt.  We have no clue when Yoda made his lightsaber in his long, long life, or what he was like as a youth.  Ahsoka's second blade was more yellow than her first after a year or so of war and training by Anakin, both of which should have changed her outlook in life.  The Temple Guard sabers are yellow which would be about the balance point between blue and red on the EM Spectrum, perhaps to signify the scales of justice.  We've not seen an Orange saber in the current canon.  Windu's is purple.  Would that mean he could not fall to the dark side, or that he's Light Side was equal to the strongest dark sider?   The white sabers are a mix of the entire spectrum.  It is speculation at this point.

The Darksaber is still an anomaly, but we'll be seeing it again really soon in Rebels.

The crystal Ezra found on Lothal was already blue, and continued to be blue until the saber's destruction on Malachor. It was not retrieved in the exodus. Plus, why would his new crystal have gone to green, when it was made very evident that he was falling more and more to the dark side? The crystal should have been moving to red if this theory is to pan out. Plus, if Force alignment determined color, why didn't Vader's Graflex start changing to red? ô¿o Don't get me wrong, a Flex in red would look killer. (No pun intended.)

The dark saber is another sci-fi abomination concocted to drive ratings up. I've actually developed a practical theory for how a "black" saber could be created, but I sincerely doubt the writers of TCW ever came close. It would be along to lines of the black blade from TFU. Ya know, has a blade shape that makes sense?

[Obese Wan Kenobese]

I never read it that the color changes during use, but during meditation for construction. Or, the crystal was a different kind. But, that's out with the cleansing. Heir to the Jedi is within Disney canon. 3 amethyst kyber crystals in the rodian's saber. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Huulik's_lightsaber

I'm no fan of the Harry Potteresque 'your wand/crystal chooses you' garbage. Let me guess. Rey's crystal will be the same one or type that chose Ben/Kylo? Does she have a mark on her head from where he tried to kill her as a child, instead only resulting in memory loss when his own force energy was cast back at him because of her parent's love? I like when character traits define the story, not just things happening with characters as place holders like a little boy that had the stone all along or a teenage boy that had the wand all along. So, I liked when the Jedi had a color that reflected their influence.

[ithekro]

The crystal Ezra found on Lothal was already blue, and continued to be blue until the saber's destruction on Malachor. It was not retrieved in the exodus. Plus, why would his new crystal have gone to green, when it was made very evident that he was falling more and more to the dark side? The crystal should have been moving to red if this theory is to pan out. Plus, if Force alignment determined color, why didn't Vader's Graflex start changing to red? ô¿o Don't get me wrong, a Flex in red would look killer. (No pun intended.)

If a shift towards the Dark Side is evident via the EM spectrum, than a shift from blue to green would be a shift towards the dark side (as green is closer to red than blue is).  Ezra was likely not trying to dominate his crystal, but still following Kanan's teaching for its construction.  his thoughts might have betrayed him turning it green, but he hasn't fallen completely as of yet.   As for Anakin...he's emotions might have been on a high from sleeping with Padme before heading back out to the war.  Honeymoon bliss clearing his mind a bit.

Or course that would bring up, why is Yoda's lightsaber green when he seems to have rejected the Dark Side entirely?  We have no clue when Yoda built his lightsaber, and given what we saw on his Force quest, he did at one point have a bit of a dark side in him.  How long ago that was....we don't know.

The majority of the reason we even have this explanation is to show how Ahsoka got her white lightsaber blades.  It potentially solves three problems: 1. Why are they white?  2. How could she get them if the Empire holds places like Illum?  3. How has she kept in practice over the years that she can defeat two Inquisitors with no trouble?


As for Rey, they've cleared Ben from being involved in her being left on Jakku, as Ben was still training with Luke to be a Jedi six years before TFA, while Rey has been on Jakku for at least a decade.

[Darth Logos]

How often, in OC or DC, is the Force able to be applied with some level of permanence without constant focus; similar to a cast spell, it remains until it is removed?

[ithekro]

Most mind tricks seem to stay in place.  Healing seems to continue afterwards, but this could be the body working as normal afterwards.  Most other instances of the use of the Force seems to be for specific purposes.  The Nightwitches magics seem to be more permanent, but we don't know how active Mother is with the likes of Savage's bulk or Maul's legs.   I think Maul has his legs replaced by Death Watch, so he's less magical.

[Darth Logos]

Most mind tricks seem to stay in place.  Healing seems to continue afterwards, but this could be the body working as normal afterwards.  Most other instances of the use of the Force seems to be for specific purposes.  The Nightwitches magics seem to be more permanent, but we don't know how active Mother is with the likes of Savage's bulk or Maul's legs.   I think Maul has his legs replaced by Death Watch, so he's less magical.

Not exactly what I'm talking about, plus I have no reference to which you speak.

In another thread, the topic of Mace's missing hand arose. I started wondering, what if a limb were lost by means other than a saber or the would failed to cauterize? Would the Force be able to be used to "cap-off" the wound like tourniquet, but the..........

Actually scratch that. When KR snagged that blaster bolt, is it known whether he had to consciously focus on it despite not continuing the gesture associated with using the Force. He seemed to grab it, and then relaxed, as though no further effort was required.

[Obese Wan Kenobese]

I really thought he was holding it and then let go as he walked away. The gesture was more a reflex we do when we think about things. I've always thought the gestures were just that. Not part of the move, but helpful to or in response to the Force user's focus. Just my take on it for now.

[ithekro]

Lightsabers usually cauterize the wound as seen on the clone trooper that have limps cut off.  So Anakin's blade should have cautarized Mace's arm.  What the Force lightning plus Palpatine ragdolling him out the window did is unclear. 

[Darth Logos]

I really thought he was holding it and then let go as he walked away. The gesture was more a reflex we do when we think about things. I've always thought the gestures were just that. Not part of the move, but helpful to or in response to the Force user's focus. Just my take on it for now.

You speak of the gesture being part of the "meditation", but not fully necessary?

[Obese Wan Kenobese]

You speak of the gesture being part of the "meditation", but not fully necessary?

I have always thought of it as just easier or automatic for the characters to raise their arm to reach out to what they are doing, not essential for them to do it. Luke moved multiple stones while doing a hand stand. Yoda reached out to the X-wing. It's not necessary, it's just something we all kinda do when we think about moving things. So, the way I interpreted the TFA scene is that Kylo suddenly reacted to the blaster bolt, immediately stopping and holding the bolt and Poe in their tracks. When the Stormtroopers grab Poe, he becomes able to move again. He's taken in front of Kylo, who is now standing arms at his side while the bolt is still floating and vibrating in air. When Kylo walks away, the bolt restores movement. I thought Kylo was holding the bolt the entire time. His reaching out was just a reflex in the sudden reaction of the moment. There are examples of those who move their hands and examples of those who just sit still while moving things.

From a directing stand point, building a scene to tell a story, it makes it clear to us that this man in black is using the Force when he reaches out. We know immediately that it's him stopping the blaster bolt. Then, we see he's able to maintain focus when relaxed, like it's easy for him. The blaster moves with full potency when he walks away, because that's when he let go. That part did bug me. If I stop a baseball with the Force, it won't resume toward the catcher's glove when I let go. Would plasma maintain directionality and kinetic energy when held and released? It's just a matter of what was the writer's intention. Perhaps Kylo held the energy active. Perhaps he contained it in a field like a saber and then pushed it afterword.

[Darth Calon]

I have always thought of it as just easier or automatic for the characters to raise their arm to reach out to what they are doing, not essential for them to do it. Luke moved multiple stones while doing a hand stand. Yoda reached out to the X-wing. It's not necessary, it's just something we all kinda do when we think about moving things. So, the way I interpreted the TFA scene is that Kylo suddenly reacted to the blaster bolt, immediately stopping and holding the bolt and Poe in their tracks. When the Stormtroopers grab Poe, he becomes able to move again. He's taken in front of Kylo, who is now standing arms at his side while the bolt is still floating and vibrating in air. When Kylo walks away, the bolt restores movement. I thought Kylo was holding the bolt the entire time. His reaching out was just a reflex in the sudden reaction of the moment. There are examples of those who move their hands and examples of those who just sit still while moving things.

From a directing stand point, building a scene to tell a story, it makes it clear to us that this man in black is using the Force when he reaches out. We know immediately that it's him stopping the blaster bolt. Then, we see he's able to maintain focus when relaxed, like it's easy for him. The blaster moves with full potency when he walks away, because that's when he let go. That part did bug me. If I stop a baseball with the Force, it won't resume toward the catcher's glove when I let go. Would plasma maintain directionality and kinetic energy when held and released? It's just a matter of what was the writer's intention. Perhaps Kylo held the energy active. Perhaps he contained it in a field like a saber and then pushed it afterword.

I'm liking your theory. As for Kylo, it could have been equally scary for the villagers if he didn't move and the bolt just stopped.

[Darth Logos]

I have always thought of it as just easier or automatic for the characters to raise their arm to reach out to what they are doing, not essential for them to do it. Luke moved multiple stones while doing a hand stand. Yoda reached out to the X-wing. It's not necessary, it's just something we all kinda do when we think about moving things. So, the way I interpreted the TFA scene is that Kylo suddenly reacted to the blaster bolt, immediately stopping and holding the bolt and Poe in their tracks. When the Stormtroopers grab Poe, he becomes able to move again. He's taken in front of Kylo, who is now standing arms at his side while the bolt is still floating and vibrating in air. When Kylo walks away, the bolt restores movement. I thought Kylo was holding the bolt the entire time. His reaching out was just a reflex in the sudden reaction of the moment. There are examples of those who move their hands and examples of those who just sit still while moving things.

From a directing stand point, building a scene to tell a story, it makes it clear to us that this man in black is using the Force when he reaches out. We know immediately that it's him stopping the blaster bolt. Then, we see he's able to maintain focus when relaxed, like it's easy for him. The blaster moves with full potency when he walks away, because that's when he let go. That part did bug me. If I stop a baseball with the Force, it won't resume toward the catcher's glove when I let go. Would plasma maintain directionality and kinetic energy when held and released? It's just a matter of what was the writer's intention. Perhaps Kylo held the energy active. Perhaps he contained it in a field like a saber and then pushed it afterword.

I would have thought it would be infinitely more imposing had the bolt froze simply by him looking at it.

As far as the Yoda thing, I think they botched his teaching from ESB "Size matters not." Because in ATC he looked like he had to really put effort behind stopping the pillar thing from crushing his boys. he should have been easily able to snag it out of the air with one hand and oopsed it into Dooku's ship. Bada-bing, bada-bang, bada-boom....war's over.

[Darth Calon]

I would have thought it would be infinitely more imposing had the bolt froze simply by him looking at it.

Agreed!

As far as the Yoda thing, I think they botched his teaching from ESB "Size matters not." Because in ATC he looked like he had to really put effort behind stopping the pillar thing from crushing his boys. he should have been easily able to snag it out of the air with one hand and oopsed it into Dooku's ship. Bada-bing, bada-bang, bada-boom....war's over.

That pillar wasn't exactly light. I know Dooku used it to escape, but why didn't he just kill Yoda when the pillar was falling and then leave?

[Landen Se-Sentien]

Dooku knew he couldn't defeat Yoda, so that's why he had to leave. Had he attacked Yoda when he was distracted, Yoda likely would have saved himself and allowed Obi-Wan and Anakin to die. It would have been better to not have all 3 of them die, because if Dooku had finished him, he would've gone back to finish the other two. Yoda saving himself would've been the best choice in such a dilemma. It also would've meant the end for Dooku. Think back to his teachings to Luke before he left to fight Vader in ESB. Luke didn't want his friends to die, but Yoda thought Luke staying would've been better for the greater good. When looking at the big picture, sometimes saving oneself is better, and sometimes sacrificing oneself is better.

As for the weight thing, I agree that the pillar wasn't light. That's why Dooku used it. Let's also consider some other things.

In the swamp, Yoda had to close his eyes and focus very intently to lift the X-Wing. He also opened them very slowly after pulling it out, which indicates some fatigue. I don't think it was easy, even for him. His whole point, though, is, "If I can do it, at my size, so can you." And, Dooku was highly gifted at telekinesis. In fact, this was a subject Dooku wrote papers and taught on to other Jedi. I doubt he would have simply let gravity do the work. He likely directed it towards Anakin and Obi-Wan. This means that Yoda not only had to overcome the weight of the pillar, which was massive, but also Dooku's incredibly strong pull on it. We've already seen in plenty of other instances that the Force can continue to act on an object, even if the user isn't focused on it (Vader vs. Luke in Bespin, Luke vs. the guards at Jabba's palace, Kylo Ren and the laser volt, etc.). It's very similar to how Yoda had to strain to redirect the chairs being hurled at him by Palpatine when they fought in the Senate chamber. That's why I think he had to strain himself so much. Dooku's Force ability was still acting on it.

[Darth Calon]

You're making good sense. One other thing, couldn't Yoda have killed Dooku when he was cracking the base of the pillar? I haven't seen it in a long time so I don't know how much time he would have had. Or if he was even trying to kill him.