The Problem with the Characters in DC Films

[Darth Knox]

Some people love them, some people hate them. Whatever your opinion on the recent DC films so far, one thing is clear: currently they do not have the same general audience appeal and critical reception as their counterparts in the MCU.

This is not an attempt to bash DC or their films, but this video does a really good job of explaining why the current crop of characters in the DC films are not currently universally loved.

PLEASE NOTE - I am not saying I agree or disagree with the viewpoint presented. I just thought it was an intelligent and well-balanced video that might encourage intelligent discourse.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXpiRzumrVY&amp;t=203s" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXpiRzumrVY&amp;t=203s</a>

[LivingBrain]

EXCELLENT video! Thank you so much for sharing!

-1

[Darth Knox]

You're welcome. Like I said, I think it is a very intelligent and well balanced video. A lot of what he said makes sense. I also think that DC are trying to do too much too soon. The MCU took several movies to build up their characters and the internal conflict/disagreements. Funnily enough, when you look at both companies objectively, DC actually has the bigger superheroes (Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, Flash, Green Lantern - they are all essentially gods, with the possible exception of Batman). However, Marvel has translated their characters to the big screen much much better, to the point they make it look easy.

ironically, DC knows how to translate their characters well on TV. I heard today that standalone Flash movie that is supposed to come out next year is having a page 1 script rewrite (after already having three directors walk away from the project).

[LivingBrain]

You're welcome. Like I said, I think it is a very intelligent and well balanced video. A lot of what he said makes sense. I also think that DC are trying to do too much too soon. The MCU took several movies to build up their characters and the internal conflict/disagreements. Funnily enough, when you look at both companies objectively, DC actually has the bigger superheroes (Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, Flash, Green Lantern - they are all essentially gods, with the possible exception of Batman). However, Marvel has translated their characters to the big screen much much better, to the point they make it look easy.

ironically, DC knows how to translate their characters well on TV. I heard today that standalone Flash movie that is supposed to come out next year is having a page 1 script rewrite (after already having three directors walk away from the project).

MAN OF STEEL should have stayed its original course and been a solo movie. Script issues aside it's a decent alternate take in some respects, but building a universe off of it is misguided because its deconstructionist tendencies will work against you. BVS continued that streak and threw in a crapton of characters, then SUICIDE SQUAD course corrected so hard to the point where its "fun" tone was just hackneyed and plastic, and now JUSTICE LEAGUE looks like another harsh course correction.

It's honestly just ridiculous. I would give so much to be a fly on the wall in their meetings to see how much of it is bad leadership and how much is just artistic incompetence. I'm at the point where I don't care whenever I see news about them. Even WONDER WOMAN isn't giving me hype anymore.

[Obese Wan Kenobese]

He's pointed out all the stuff for which I get my head bitten off when I speak of MoS. He also points out issues similar to what I've mentioned needs developing in TFA.

[Darth Knox]

MAN OF STEEL should have stayed its original course and been a solo movie. Script issues aside it's a decent alternate take in some respects, but building a universe off of it is misguided because its deconstructionist tendencies will work against you. BVS continued that streak and threw in a crapton of characters, then SUICIDE SQUAD course corrected so hard to the point where its "fun" tone was just hackneyed and plastic, and now JUSTICE LEAGUE looks like another harsh course correction.

It's honestly just ridiculous. I would give so much to be a fly on the wall in their meetings to see how much of it is bad leadership and how much is just artistic incompetence. I'm at the point where I don't care whenever I see news about them. Even WONDER WOMAN isn't giving me hype anymore.

Actually Wonder Woman gives me hope because it is a completely different team making that than were involved with MoS, BvS, SS or JL. Plus a period setting against WW1. But, if it's the same kind of thing as we've seen in the other movies I think the DCEU will be royally screwed (in the movies).

He's pointed out all the stuff for which I get my head bitten off when I speak of MoS. He also points out issues similar to what I've mentioned needs developing in TFA.

Who bit your head off? And was that because of your opinions or just from internet trolls who are diehard DC fans and refuse to accept anything bad with that movie?

As for TFA, that is in a very different camp to where DC is now.

[LivingBrain]

Actually Wonder Woman gives me hope because it is a completely different team making that than were involved with MoS, BvS, SS or JL. Plus a period setting against WW1. But, if it's the same kind of thing as we've seen in the other movies I think the DCEU will be royally screwed (in the movies).

Very true. I won't give up completely, but I will be seeing it with bated breath.

[Darth Knox]

Very true. I won't give up completely, but I will be seeing it with bated breath.

Same here. One thing DC is REALLY good at is making amazing trailers for their movies. Unfortunately, given their movie track record so far, my expectations have been altered accordingly. I do WANT it to be good though. Not only for DC's sake, but for the sake of female led superhero movies in general.

[Kham-Ryn Kurios]

I think everyone (The internet, and other media outlets) have sucked the fun out of movies. They are no longer a place of escapism, but rather a place of validation for our opinions, and misplaced passions.

I understand analysing film, that makes sense, but it has reached a point of overanalysis.

[Darth Knox]

I think everyone has sucked the fun out of movies. They are no longer a place of escapism, but rather a place of validation for our opinions, and misplaced passions.

DC movies or all movies?
Although I see where you are coming from. I think the onset of that happened when they took something that for generations was very niche (comic books) and made it popular with the mainstream. Battle lines were drawn, war paint applied, inhalers used, glasses tucked away for safety and the keyboard wars began! LOL

But I think, deep down, all the criticisms and conversations comes from the same place: people want these movies to be AMAZING (not just good)

[Kham-Ryn Kurios]

DC movies or all movies?
Although I see where you are coming from. I think the onset of that happened when they took something that for generations was very niche (comic books) and made it popular with the mainstream. Battle lines were drawn, war paint applied, inhalers used, glasses tucked away for safety and the keyboard wars began! LOL

But I think, deep down, all the criticisms and conversations comes from the same place: people want these movies to be AMAZING (not just good)

More of a statement about all movies.

A lot of the reviews I see for movies nowadays mainly talk about how the movie is "not this", or how "(Insert Name) did it better," rather than an objective look (like the video above that you shared) at the given film.

I honestly would not have gone to the theater to see "The Nice Guys" had you not sung your praise for it. Because most of what I saw written about it, while not overly negative, focused on those aspects instead of raising up the positives.

[LivingBrain]

I think everyone (The internet, and other media outlets) have sucked the fun out of movies. They are no longer a place of escapism, but rather a place of validation for our opinions, and misplaced passions.

I understand analysing film, that makes sense, but it has reached a point of overanalysis.

I think it depends on the source from where you're getting the analysis. On all of my favorite movie sites there's the fair share of "WORST MOVI EVUR" and "LOOK AT ALL THESE PLOT HOLES" type articles, but then there are ones that are genuinely insightful looks that either show legitimate flaws in the storytelling or find new depths to the film's themes. For every Jeremy Jahns and LightsCameraJackson, there's a Tony Zhou and David Ehrlich.

[Darth Knox]

More of a statement about all movies.

A lot of the reviews I see for movies nowadays mainly talk about how the movie is "not this", or how "(Insert Name) did it better," rather than an objective look (like the video above that you shared) at the given film.

I honestly would not have gone to the theater to see "The Nice Guys" had you not sung your praise for it. Because most of what I saw written about it, while not overly negative, focused on those aspects instead of raising up the positives.

I always try to take each movie on it's own merit and would only compare it to other movies in that genre if I needed to when I'm reviewing a movie. That's getting harder to do though as more and more combined cinematic universes pop up. However, the rise of importance of the internet means that anyone and everyone can voice their opinions now, whereas before it was limited to whichever movie pundits you watched and your circle of friends.

The anonymity of the internet and the rise of the trolls can make talking about movies draining at times. And there are some people who genuinely make clickbait articles and videos just to be controversial and get views. That is why there are a handful of movie shows on youtube I watch, as they always give well balanced reviews and opinions (although I never let that factor into whether I personally will ever watch a movie).

I'm glad you enjoyed The Nice Guys. I just wish it had done better at the box office so studios would produce more original movies like that (not that I don't love my comic book films. But variety is the spice of life).

I think as a geeky community who are passionate about "our" franchises, we can be guilty of being over-zealous and/or over-defensive when discussing our stuff. But, life without passion would be boring (kinda like the Jedi! LOL)