Random Thoughts of Members (anything goes...well with in forum rules)

[Darth Knox]

I have the really awesome documentary set on F13th . . . believe it or not, the sample is actually:

"ki ki ki ma ma ma"

The guy doing the music had the line "Kill her, Mommy! Kill her!" in mind when he did it.

really? That's awesome! Love finding out BTS stuff like that. Have you seen Never Sleep Again, the four hour documentary that talks about the entire Nightmae on Elm Street films with interviews with everyone who was involved in making all the movies.

[DarthScrub]

really? That's awesome! Love finding out BTS styf like that. Have you seen Never Sleep Again, the four hour documentary that talks about the entire Nightmae on Elm Street films with interviews with everyone who was involved in making all the movies.

I own it! Back when they were making it, I was able to preorder it A really fun watch

[Darth Knox]

I own it! Back when they were making it, I was able to preorder it A really fun watch

it's great. Not not learning about everything that went into creating the films, but learning more about the actors. And there is no bad to more Robert Englund.

[Lord Canterbury]

really? That's awesome! Love finding out BTS stuff like that. Have you seen Never Sleep Again, the four hour documentary that talks about the entire Nightmae on Elm Street films with interviews with everyone who was involved in making all the movies.

Yep . . . that one's fantastic.  I believe it's still available to stream on Netflix.

This is the F13th one . . . well worth seeing . . . clocks in about 6.5 hours.

And . . . I think I'm actually gonna pop this in now, ha!  Perfect background entertainment for writing my Consular review . . . and since the wife & daughter aren't home!

(One drawback of parenthood.  For some crazy reason, my wife doesn't want me watching The Texas Chainsaw Massacre or a Dario Argento giallo while my 1.5 year old daughter is around.    )

[LivingBrain]

As long as she has red hair, she will be MJ. The argument that her race is irrelevant to her character is true. However, red hair is her defining characteristic.

I love redheads. 

Redheads are great, but I don't think that's necessary to her character either. If it were, then I would consider her to be a pretty shallow character (which may actually be kind of true in a lot of cases   ). The MJ I've seen from the comics, movies, and TV shows is sassy, powerful, and puts on a persona to hide a strong inner emotional life full of hurt, and these are all things that I don't think are intrinsically tied to red hair.

I actually think that Zendaya is more than perfect for the role. Just watch this interview with Ellen:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOlL48Mgklk" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOlL48Mgklk</a>

She's sassy, funny, and has a strong attitude, and the way she explains her relationship with her parents suggests strong emotional intelligence as well. She talks about setting boundaries with them, which is something that people who know themselves well do with others in order to protect themselves emotionally. What this means is that she gets emotion, she knows how she can be affected, and it's likely that these boundaries mean there was trouble with her parents in the past. What all of this comes together to mean is that she would have no trouble communicating the inner hurt that's required for MJ.

She also shows a lot of spunkiness in this video with her castmates:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPBDIfwx-z0" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPBDIfwx-z0</a>

And in this music video, she sports a smoldering look on multiple occasions that just screams "MJ!"

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyLE48i4XY0" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyLE48i4XY0</a>

I think this is perfect casting, and I desperately hope the reports of it are true (yeah, reliable sources have confirmed it, but I'm so hyped about it that I don't want to be disappointed and really want official studio confirmation lol).

So basically, I'm agreeing with you that race doesn't matter with her character, but I also want to take it a step further and say that red hair itself isn't important. I think characters are always more than physical characteristics and, while there are many, many characters that do have important physical features that define them, I don't think MJ's red hair falls under that category, nor should it.

But that's just my take on the whole thing.

[Kham-Ryn Kurios]

Mary Jane Watson has red hair, regardless of the characteristics of her personality, it is important to her identity, and one that people identify with that character.

At least once a week someone say's my wife looks like Mary Jane, physically she looks nothing like the character, except that she has deep-red hair and a similar haircut; people with a passing knowledge of Spider-Man. So the notion that the character shouldn't be defined by that characteristic is irrelevant next to the fact that general audiences (not just us fans) identify that character by her red hair. We know who cap is because of the Stars and Stripes, we know who Iron Man is because of his Red and Yellow armor, however, MJ doesn't wear a costume, instead she is identified by her fiery red hair.

[LivingBrain]

It is still a defining characteristic, one that people identify with that character. Mary Jane Watson has red hair, regardless of the characteristics of her personality, it is important to her identity.

You're right that people do associate it with her, so I guess in this case I just don't think it should be that way, if that makes sense. If you can come up with an argument for why she has to have it I'd love to hear it, but otherwise we can disagree. 

[Darth Knox]

Mary Jane Watson has red hair, regardless of the characteristics of her personality, it is important to her identity, and one that people identify with that character.

At least once a week someone say's my wife looks like Mary Jane, physically she looks nothing like the character, except that she has deep-red hair and a similar haircut; people with a passing knowledge of Spider-Man. So the notion that the character shouldn't be defined by that characteristic is irrelevant next to the fact that general audiences (not just us fans) identify that character by her red hair. We know who cap is because of the Stars and Stripes, we know who Iron Man is because of his Red and Yellow armor, however, MJ doesn't wear a costume, instead she is identified by her fiery red hair.

wolverine is 5' 3 and his height is one of his defining characteristics in the comics. Hugh Jackman is 6' 2 but I don't think anyone will disagree that he totally embodies the role to the point we cannot envisage anyone else playing him.

Michael Keaton was primarily known as a comic actor. Warner Bros received hate mail and a petition from people threatening to boycott the movie because they said Keaton doesn't have the ability to play the required darkness and internal turmoil of a Bruce Wayne/Batman (because this was before the Internet existed).

I'm just using these as examples of casting someone who totally embodied the character even if they didn't 100% match the looks of the character from the comics. Kirsten Dunst, who is a capable actress and did dye her hair red for her portrayal of the MJ rally didn't capture the essence of who MJ is, despite "looking" like her.

As with every casting decision, it's a case of time will tell depending on the story, direction and ability of the actress. I would prefer someone who perfectly captured the spirit of the character even if they didn't look 100% the same as the character from the comic. Just personal preference.

[LivingBrain]

wolverine is 5' 3 and his height is one of his defining characteristics in the comics. Hugh Jackman is 6' 2 but I don't think anyone will disagree that he totally embodies the role to the point we cannot envisage anyone else playing him.

Michael Keaton was primarily known as a comic actor. Warner across received hate mail and a petition from people threatening to boycott the movie because they said Keaton doesn't have the ability to play the required darkness and internal turmoil of a Bruce Wayne/Batman.

I'm just using these as examples of casting someone who totally embodied the character even if they didn't 100% match the looks of the character from the comics. Kirsten Dunst, who is a capable actress and did dye her hair red for her portrayal of the MJ rally didn't capture the essence of who MJ is, despite "looking" like her.

As with every casting decision, it's a case of time will tell depending on the story, direction and ability of the actress. I would prefer someone who perfectly captured the spirit of the character even if they didn't look 100% the same as the character from the comic. Just personal preference.

Great examples, and agreed on Kirsten Dunst. I think she and Raimi focused too much on the troubled inner life and not enough on the "party girl" aspect to counteract it, just like Raimi and Maguire focused so much on Peter's emotional struggles that they let the quipping slide.

That's actually what makes me love those movies, because my personal preference is to see a character's inner life, but I also get why the more "surface" characteristics matter too. In this case, by "surface" I mean the character's external life. For MJ that's being fun and spontaneous, and for Spidey that's being a wiseass. They're both personas to hide how afraid they are underneath.

I think the fact that MJ and Spidey both put on their own masks is what makes their relationship so fascinating. While MJ is more extraverted and brings Peter out of his shell and Peter stabilizes MJ's turmoil, what they both have in common is that they lie to others to hide their true selves. They're different, yet the same, and they complement each other really well. They can both strengthen the other while finding solace in each other.

I'm really hoping the new movies can focus on this because the Raimi movies, while still having a solid romance and great inner lives for the characters, missed the opportunity for more nuance in their relationship (and the characters themselves; MJ especially suffered from this) by neglecting the characters' external lives.

Ultimately, this made their relationship feel "comfortable." Maguire and Dunst didn't have the fun, external sides of the characters to give the relationship a spark so, while it felt good and natural, there wasn't anything exciting about their romance. Garfield and Stone, on the other hand, had all of the spark, but none of the depth. This really gives HOMECOMING and future Spidey movies a unique opportunity to improve on past Spidey movies, because they could be the first to get both aspects correct.

[DarthScrub]

Can I just say, I'm still salty The Amazing Spiderman films were deemed unsuccessful just because they didn't make as much as the first trilogy. In my opinion, Andrew Garfield's portrayal of Spiderman was perfect, even if his Peter Parker was more high school hipster rather than introverted.

[LivingBrain]

Can I just say, I'm still salty The Amazing Spiderman films were deemed unsuccessful just because they didn't make as much as the first trilogy. In my opinion, Andrew Garfield's portrayal of Spiderman was perfect, even if his Peter Parker was more high school hipster rather than introverted.

You can absolutely say that! Can I respond with an argument disagreeing or would you prefer to just leave your post here?

[DarthScrub]

lmao I love movies, I don't mind a discussion. What is your opinion of the films?

[Duff Man]

was that at Camp Crystal Lake?

pretty much, but all the kids were Jason

wolverine is 5' 3 and his height is one of his defining characteristics in the comics. Hugh Jackman is 6' 2 but I don't think anyone will disagree that he totally embodies the role to the point we cannot envisage anyone else playing him.

Michael Keaton was primarily known as a comic actor. Warner across received hate mail and a petition from people threatening to boycott the movie because they said Keaton doesn't have the ability to play the required darkness and internal turmoil of a Bruce Wayne/Batman.

I'm just using these as examples of casting someone who totally embodied the character even if they didn't 100% match the looks of the character from the comics. Kirsten Dunst, who is a capable actress and did dye her hair red for her portrayal of the MJ rally didn't capture the essence of who MJ is, despite "looking" like her.

As with every casting decision, it's a case of time will tell depending on the story, direction and ability of the actress. I would prefer someone who perfectly captured the spirit of the character even if they didn't look 100% the same as the character from the comic. Just personal preference.

this kinda makes me want to break out batman and batman returns?

[Darth Knox]

As they are still in high school, I think they will focus on MJ's early years and her troubled home life, contrasting with the mask she wears in public. I don't think she and Peter will get together in this movie though. That is inkeeping with the comics, but will give them room to grow with future movies if they just show that their are friends and show the beginnings/potential for romance.

They have said they are going for a John Hughes style high school movie. With superpowers. Which I think is gonna be awesome. Although with three villains mentioned I hope they don't do a Spiderman 3 and over stuff the movie. I'd prefer the opening scene to start mid-battle with the Shocker and then show him being late for school, with the Tinkerer being a minor presence and the Vulture being the big bad.

Can I just say, I'm still salty The Amazing Spiderman films were deemed unsuccessful just because they didn't make as much as the first trilogy. In my opinion, Andrew Garfield's portrayal of Spiderman was perfect, even if his Peter Parker was more high school hipster rather than introverted.

i liked the first Amazing Spiderman and it was a great foundation for future events movies. However I thought the second was awful, as the studio was so concerned with making a franchise of spider spin-off movies they forget to make ASM2 good.

Andrew Garfield was great as Parker but I fully understand recasting him. Not his fault, but Marvel want a clean slate for introducing him into the MCU.

[Darth Knox]

Nostalgia Critic did a great "old vs new" comparing the Spiderman movies. Really interesting. See if you guys agree

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP2GMV8aKaY&amp;feature=youtu.be" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP2GMV8aKaY&amp;feature=youtu.be</a>