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Author Topic: New Saber duelist, old school fighter  (Read 241 times)
SpaceDonny
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« on: December 04, 2018, 08:41:09 PM »

Hello!

I am a HEMA instructor who teaches medieval sword and buckler fighting as well as German Longsword. I also teach a British singlestick course and have practiced a ton of military saber (specifically Scottish Baskethilt). Swordfighting has always been intriguing to me but what intrigues me equally is lightsaber combat. I thought it would be fun to start exploring the art and what better place than to start here?

I am completely new to this and eager to learn. Are there books or webpages I can go to learn more about the actual combat styles? In all honesty, this is more exploratory and who knows where it will wind up. What I would really like is for more tournaments to go to. HEMA and Singlestick tournaments can be few and far between.

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Master Althalus
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« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2018, 06:27:43 AM »

Welcome! I'm also a HEMA instructor, teaching Bolognese swordsmanship, Italian military sabre, and walking cane.

Basically, you already know what there is to know - you'll probably beat most (pure) saberists out there relying on singlestick alone. Combine it with longsword and there is not much that will be missing.

What makes lightsabering interesting are the possibilities. There are no sources to adhere to, no ancient teachings, no doctrines. You can just absorb what is useful and discard what is not.

 
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SpaceDonny
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« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2018, 07:14:43 AM »

Great to meet you! So are thrusts allowed? I saw rules against fighting with one hand.
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Golden Fedora
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« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2018, 07:39:34 AM »

Great to meet you! So are thrusts allowed? I saw rules against fighting with one hand.

in certain clubs they are, others they aren't. In the league I'm in, point attacks and point-in-line attacks are not allowed. mainly because we don't want to wear a crazy amount of armor.
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Master Althalus
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« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2018, 09:19:05 AM »

Quote
So are thrusts allowed? I saw rules against fighting with one hand.
We allow them - but without handguard, thrusting is not really the go-to technique. Mostly results in double-hits - and I HATE double-hits.  Grin
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Sabers
Emerald: Dark Mantis
Obsidian v4: Shock, Dark Initiate v4, Consular
Obsidian Lite: Aeon v4, Dominix LE v4
Stunt: Apprentice v4, Initiate LE v2, Aeon v4

SpaceDonny
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« Reply #5 on: December 05, 2018, 01:24:34 PM »

We allow them - but without handguard, thrusting is not really the go-to technique. Mostly results in double-hits - and I HATE double-hits.  Grin

So how do tournaments rule double-hits? One set of rules I saw said first hit wins. Iím much more interested in reducing doubles wherever possible.
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Master Althalus
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« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2018, 05:18:23 PM »

There's quite a lot of different rule-sets out there (just as there are a lot of different rule-sets for HEMA).
My club (SaberAcademy Vienna) uses a ruleset, where doubles score normal for both opponents, but you are allowed only 2 doubles per match. The third means a lost match for both.

Looking at tournament fights from different schools, it looks a lot like in HEMA five years ago: blade-fishing and hand-sniping, wild bashing, lurking and catapult-fencing... it's all there.  Wink

The greatest strength of lightsabering is also its greatest weakness IMHO. The fun-factor is so high, that quite a lot of people fight without basic skill. It's just a plastic tube, after all...
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Sabers
Emerald: Dark Mantis
Obsidian v4: Shock, Dark Initiate v4, Consular
Obsidian Lite: Aeon v4, Dominix LE v4
Stunt: Apprentice v4, Initiate LE v2, Aeon v4

SpaceDonny
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« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2018, 07:39:29 AM »

There's quite a lot of different rule-sets out there (just as there are a lot of different rule-sets for HEMA).
My club (SaberAcademy Vienna) uses a ruleset, where doubles score normal for both opponents, but you are allowed only 2 doubles per match. The third means a lost match for both.

Looking at tournament fights from different schools, it looks a lot like in HEMA five years ago: blade-fishing and hand-sniping, wild bashing, lurking and catapult-fencing... it's all there.  Wink

The greatest strength of lightsabering is also its greatest weakness IMHO. The fun-factor is so high, that quite a lot of people fight without basic skill. It's just a plastic tube, after all...

Interesting. I like your doubles rule. We use the same one for singlestick as well but doubles award no points. As someone who has always been in favor of ďbeat your opponent anyway you canĒ Iím all for hand-swipes and catapult fencing.  Maybe thatís because they are easy to deal with once you practice it lol.

Thanks for all the great info! I really appreciate it.

So how does the blade and hilt work for ultra saber? Does the blade go through the handle?
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Master Althalus
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« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2018, 01:22:47 AM »

Quote
So how does the blade and hilt work for ultra saber? Does the blade go through the handle?
As with all manufacturers I've experience with, the blade is inserted about 2" into the hilt and pressed in with a retention screw. Holds up good.
Quote
We use the same one for singlestick as well but doubles award no points.
The thing gets really funny when used in our tournamen-rules we took over from our HEMA-club: First rounds are fought on a placed vs. received count with weighted hit-locations, so doubles can mean you're not making it to the second round of fights. Wink
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Sabers
Emerald: Dark Mantis
Obsidian v4: Shock, Dark Initiate v4, Consular
Obsidian Lite: Aeon v4, Dominix LE v4
Stunt: Apprentice v4, Initiate LE v2, Aeon v4

SpaceDonny
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« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2018, 02:26:48 PM »

So where do I find a list of tournaments and where can I find clubs?
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SpaceDonny
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« Reply #10 on: December 07, 2018, 12:40:59 PM »

Also, what is a good hilt for one or two hands?
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chalion
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« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2018, 10:37:35 AM »

Also, what is a good hilt for one or two hands?

In my limited experience, any UltraSabers hilt in the $70 to $100 can be easily used 1 handed or 2 handed. The Dominix V4 is almost a hand 1/2. With formal dueling, a 36" Ultra Edge Heavy Duty blade is normal, since it offsets the normal length to weight ratio in normal Bokken. (the heavier denser polycarbonite tube is not to the weight a metal blade would be, but the hollow hilt is also much lighter then a formal sword hilt would be).

Myself, I use 32" blades, but i'm shorter than norm. I do not have formal training though, so your uses will be different than mine.
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StoryDtechtive
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« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2018, 02:47:59 PM »

Also, what is a good hilt for one or two hands?

The Dominix and Aeons seem like favorites among enthusiastic dualists. The Sentinal would be another one large enough for one and two hands.

I donít have as many sabers as some folks here, but I can tell you the baseline of US really are great designs for comfort of spinning without a lot of things projecting out to get in the way. The US slogan of being the combat specialists is really apparent once you get your hands on one of these. Also, the pictures online really do not do them justice.  There is an elegant aesthetic to these sabers you really have to experience first hand.

My personal preference is to switch out most low profile pommels Iíve seen on their baseline sabers with something that adds a little more character. And for the Initiates and Apprentices, the addition of the new pommel gives it enough length for two hands (unless you have hands the size of a Christmas ham), but those are mainly single-handed sabers with the smaller pommels they come with. Good for spinning because they are very light, but would lack the length and weight for heavier dueling unless you invest in a more beefy pommel capable of adding 1 1/2-2 inches to their length, IMHO. But youíll see you have a very functional saber with any of these models. Just be sure to make the choice thatís right for you based on your intended uses and youíll be very happy with your purchase. The fact everyone here keeps coming back for more is the strongest testimony on that score  Smiley
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SpaceDonny
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« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2018, 12:00:19 AM »

Thank you for all of the feedback!

I wound up getting two sentinels. I suspect Iíll fight one-handed predominately due to my military saber and sword and buckler background. However I wanted the option to also fight with two hands because most of the people in my club do Longsword and I suspect (and hope) they will be interested in joining me in learning.
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