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Author Topic: Hilt vs. Grip : Fancy is the enemy of swordplay  (Read 2328 times)
janx
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« on: June 17, 2019, 02:53:22 PM »

I went to my first saber class this weekend with my Grand Master.

I'd already worked out that with the fancy stuff on it, one has to hold it a certain way due to the struts on the top half.

We worked on simple two-handed attacks.  as my arms tired and after class we compared sabers, some things became obvious.

Simple hilt sabers allow you to grip higher up.  This shifts your hand closer to the balance point, making the blade feel lighter.

Top it off, my Grand Master was one of the heaviest sabers in the class (the Emperor's hand seems to top it).

Conversely, my wife's Azure Savior was the lightest in the class.  Though the nurled screw came out on hers during drills.  Have to use locktite on it.



For serious sword-work, keep it in mind that the plainer hilts are likely better.

I'm thinking about a Prophecy which I hope accommodates sword fighting better while still looking cool

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Karmack
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« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2019, 03:42:37 PM »

I went to my first saber class this weekend with my Grand Master.

I'd already worked out that with the fancy stuff on it, one has to hold it a certain way due to the struts on the top half.

We worked on simple two-handed attacks.  as my arms tired and after class we compared sabers, some things became obvious.

Simple hilt sabers allow you to grip higher up.  This shifts your hand closer to the balance point, making the blade feel lighter.

Top it off, my Grand Master was one of the heaviest sabers in the class (the Emperor's hand seems to top it).

Conversely, my wife's Azure Savior was the lightest in the class.  Though the nurled screw came out on hers during drills.  Have to use locktite on it.



For serious sword-work, keep it in mind that the plainer hilts are likely better.

I'm thinking about a Prophecy which I hope accommodates sword fighting better while still looking cool



To true, my friend.

The absolute best US hilt for dueling is the Aeon/Dominix V2.   :-)   

Some other excellent duelers are: Aeon/Dominix V2, 3, 4  (V5 not so much due to the claws).   Prophecy, but is a little short for two-handed grips.   Sentinel V4s are AWESOME.   Sentinel V5s are pretty good, but take a file or sander to the edges of the window area to round them off. 

Good to hear that the Savior is a good dueler.  :-)   

Oh, and another great handler is the Catalyst, the forward choke is amazing, but the 36" blade isn't super-secure.  32" blade works great, though.   

And the Liberator is also a great dueler.

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tx_tuff
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« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2019, 12:17:44 PM »

Prophecy is heavier than it looks, so may not be the best for what you are looking for.

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk

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janx
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« Reply #3 on: June 17, 2019, 08:20:52 PM »

Prophecy is heavier than it looks, so may not be the best for what you are looking for.

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk



Darn it.  I like all the ones that are bad for me Smiley

I don't want to go so basic I might as well bring a piece of PVC pipe to class instead.  Nor do I want to plug a Diamond into something I don't like how it looks.  Trying to find a hilt I like and works for sword play.  Isn't too expensive for something that's more likely to get knocked around, and not so dull that PVC is just as good.

I'll have to keep thinking.  And avoid the Savior.  You have no idea how many times my wife and I get the same dang thing at different times because we like it and it works (ex. renfair pirate hats. Prescription flip-up steampunk glasses.  Sigh).

I suspect it'll have a v4 or v4 sound and flash on clash so it looks cool during a duel. And be Blue because I already have Red.

Just need pointers on a hilt that's right for me Smiley
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tx_tuff
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« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2019, 08:34:13 PM »

So the Catalyst I think would be a good choice for what you want and it has a greay chock point.

The Reaper is lighter than it looks, especially when you take off the claws. It could also be a great choice. You could just remove the claws or even change it by replacing the emitter and pommel. You could use another US emitter and pommel or get some off of TCSS.

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk

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Illyiss
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« Reply #5 on: June 17, 2019, 09:23:07 PM »

I'm going to second the Sentinel/Dark Sentinel V4 as SUPER comfortable to duel with.  My Dark Aeon V4 is pretty comfy too.  One thing on those, the LE versions have sharper edges where the grooves are, so that may make a difference.  The Standard Issue and Dark standard issue seem pretty good, if basic (The Dark with the vertical grooves less so,but again, sand the edges of the grooves a bit).  I like how the Prophecy feels, once you take off the terribly placed (IMHO) covertec knob, but I have massive hands and arms, so the slight extra weight doesn't bug me at all.  I actually like it for balance.

I am curious about the Arbiter in this regard as well.  I know it's longer, and beefier, but both of those aspects appeal to me for reasons.  Anyone have any experience with one, in terms of hand comfort and such?
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Darth Pandæmis

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Karmack
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« Reply #6 on: June 17, 2019, 03:02:23 PM »

Darn it.  I like all the ones that are bad for me Smiley

I don't want to go so basic I might as well bring a piece of PVC pipe to class instead.  Nor do I want to plug a Diamond into something I don't like how it looks.  Trying to find a hilt I like and works for sword play.  Isn't too expensive for something that's more likely to get knocked around, and not so dull that PVC is just as good.

I'll have to keep thinking.  And avoid the Savior.  You have no idea how many times my wife and I get the same dang thing at different times because we like it and it works (ex. renfair pirate hats. Prescription flip-up steampunk glasses.  Sigh).

I suspect it'll have a v4 or v4 sound and flash on clash so it looks cool during a duel. And be Blue because I already have Red.

Just need pointers on a hilt that's right for me Smiley

Check out the Dark Catalyst.   I added a MHS Scorpion pommel to give it a bit more flare, and it would look great in blue or especially an Arctic Blue.



Or the Sentinel V5, also with either a War Glaive or Butcher pommel: (Mine with a War Glaive pommel and next to a Dominix V3)



And one more: Aeon V4.   My old one next to the ever popular Guardian, and then with another array that includes a Dominix V4 and Dominix V4 LE. 
Note: Premium pommels can really set these hilts off.









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Malik Thanewulf
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« Reply #7 on: June 17, 2019, 10:25:55 PM »

Very nice. Karmack I like what you did with the pommel Swaps. Point for creativity.
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ktulu1347
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« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2019, 11:21:30 PM »

I am curious about the Arbiter in this regard as well.  I know it's longer, and beefier, but both of those aspects appeal to me for reasons.  Anyone have any experience with one, in terms of hand comfort and such?

The Arbiter is amazing to handle.  It is indeed very long, but incredibly light and the pommel balances it perfectly.  About the only drawback is the grenade grip section, which can be a bit uncomfortable to hold too tightly.  Conversely, it gives excellent purchase for your top hand.  The Arbiter is among the sabers that have surprised me the most upon actually handling them as the mass is completely different from what you would expect.  It is among my favorite sabers to grab off the wall and swing around, a truly underappreciated masterpiece in my opinion.

On another note, I will add my voice to the Sentinel V4 chorus.  That is actually my top choice for a "using" saber with the V2 lineup a very, very close second.
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« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2019, 12:13:11 AM »

Oh, and another great handler is the Catalyst, the forward choke is amazing, but the 36" blade isn't super-secure.  32" blade works great, though.   

 This is why I changed the emitter on my dark Catalyst. I felt like at any moment the blade was going to break one inch out from the emitters end. The choke is also a little too narrow for me.
I started with a war glaive and that is still my favorite dueling saber. Minus the claws of course.

Something else to consider is how deep into the hilt the blade actually goes. The Catalyst emitter grips just under an inch of the blade.  The war glaive emitter grips about 2.5 inches of the blade.
 It is just my preference but, the deeper the blade sits in the hilt, the more battle worthy it feels to me.
War Glaive. The name says it all.
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Illyiss
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« Reply #10 on: June 18, 2019, 04:57:00 AM »

The Arbiter is amazing to handle.  It is indeed very long, but incredibly light and the pommel balances it perfectly.  About the only drawback is the grenade grip section, which can be a bit uncomfortable to hold too tightly.  Conversely, it gives excellent purchase for your top hand.  The Arbiter is among the sabers that have surprised me the most upon actually handling them as the mass is completely different from what you would expect.  It is among my favorite sabers to grab off the wall and swing around, a truly underappreciated masterpiece in my opinion.

On another note, I will add my voice to the Sentinel V4 chorus.  That is actually my top choice for a "using" saber with the V2 lineup a very, very close second.

Thanks!  Point given.   On the subject of the grenade grip and it's discomfort, is that because the edges of the machined grooves are sharp, like on say the Sentinel LE models,  or something else?
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ktulu1347
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« Reply #11 on: June 18, 2019, 06:07:40 AM »

I wouldn't call the edges of the rectangles on the Arbiter sharp, it's more that they are well defined and there's space between them.  It looks really cool, but the original grenade they kitbashed in '76 was designed for fragmentation and not actually meant to be a grip.  It works for that purpose but there is a tradeoff for the neat appearance.  It's totally serviceable, just a minor fly in the ointment.  If you're wielding the saber with two hands you might not even notice but using one hand it may dig in slightly.

In my experience grooves on LE Sentinels (at least V4s) are not noticeably sharper than their non-LE counterparts from a comfort and usefulness standpoint.  In contrast, the method of machining the admittedly sweet looking grip section on V5 Sentinels creates sharp edges which are far more annoying to me than the Arbiter grenade grip.  As I said I adore the Sentinel V4 family, but the V5 is utterly useless from a practical standpoint in my opinion without judicious use of sandpaper and the windows still ruin the choke even if you smooth the edges so as not to draw blood.
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« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2019, 06:47:20 AM »

From my personal experience (and taste) the two best hilts for swordplay/combat are: the Archon v2 and the Prophecy v3.

The Archon v2 has such a long neck and heavy pommel that the balance point is perfect for me. It makes the sword feel very light and quick single handed. The Prophecy has a very small pommel, but the user can hold the emitter area, and again it makes the whole thing feel very light and easy to swing.

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« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2019, 01:57:59 PM »

I like hilts for grips, the Aeon and Dominix V4 conforms to my hand perfectly
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Ryvius
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« Reply #14 on: June 27, 2019, 03:38:34 AM »

I've noticed no one has mentioned the Standard Issue Battle Saber. Is there any particular reason why the Aeon/Dominix is the preferred choice over it? Just curious.
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