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Author Topic: Andor: Series Thoughts  (Read 3301 times)
Lord_S_Gray
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« on: October 16, 2022, 07:36:29 AM »

So what do people think of 'Andor' I'm up to episode 3 atm and find it quite good, very 'grounded' focus on people with day jobs and daily grind concerns, much like Obi-Wan touched on at the start. Characters and their actions/Motivations seem quite realistic in terms of their goals and resources, back story flashes building in line with the main story are intriguing, showing the 'scavengers' amongst a galactic war and 'forgotten children'. 

I think it benefits, much like the Mandalorian Season 1 before it,  in focusing on a character with very little existing lore so they are not as constrained and able to make a more expansive tale than say the restrictions with Obi-Wan.

I especially like the over jumped Lieutenant of the corporate security with his righteous indignation at the opening crime, ignoring the seasoned 'cover it up' advice of his superior and going all in when he gets the chance. The 'police procedural' scene tracking Andor specifically were a nice change from Obi-wan where they simply seemed to know exactly where to go and who to find instantly at times.

It shows things taking time and effort - to make contact with people, to arrange deals and travel - and the rivalries and friendships that intersect with that.

And Andor as well, already a wheeler and dealer he gets himself in too deep this time and has to scramble to get out.

Just feels more 'real' for the setting so far to me.
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Lord_S_Gray

Surik: "Kreia, what are you—are you a Jedi, a Sith?"
Kreia: "Does it matter? Of course it does, such titles allow you to break the galaxy into light and dark, categorize it. Perhaps I am neither, and I hold both as what they are, pieces of a whole."

TheDutchman
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« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2022, 04:02:28 PM »

As I've said before, Mrs. Dutchman is NOT a fan of Star Wars (at least not like I am  Wink).

That said, she absolutely loves "Andor."  LSG brought up the fact that the show deals with "real people" living in the era of an established Empire yet one young enough that many remember the Republic.  It's this setting that my wife finds so intriguing, Andor himself a kind of audience surrogate.

Plus, she really like Diego Luna  Wink

And I agree with her: as of Episode 7, this is an enjoyable story, one that, thus far, has an adequate-if-not-outstanding multiple-arc narrative.  Oh, and before I go on:

<<<SPOILERS!!!>>>

OK, I also like how the show delves into the multiple characters and their motivations; there is a multi-layered plot populated by three-dimensional people.  Andor himself epitomizes this: his reaction to Skeen's greed&lies and his unhesitating decision isn't that of the stereotypical hero, yet that is what he is, reluctant or no.  He adheres to a code, one that often times may seem self-serving, but we as the audience can recognize his reasons for doing so.

This also extends to the scenes centering on the ISB.  Far from a unified division, the disparate personalities could be from Anywhere, Anycountry, Earth.  I guess that some things ARE universal, even in a "galaxy far, far away."

Looking forward to not only seeing where the series leads us but also other Forum members' thoughts^^
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Darth Tepes
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« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2022, 10:59:39 AM »

I tried...but I just could not get interested.  Unlike everyone else it seems, I have no interest in the "Real People".   
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Taegin Roan
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« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2022, 03:52:57 AM »

There will be a lot of people who don't like this show because it isn't about Jedi, Sith, or the Force in some way, and that's fine. I understand completely. But I love the thriller genre, and I loved the character of Cassian Andor in R1, so I was already stoked for this show long before the first trailers arrived. But I've gotta say, it's even better than I hoped. It's just been so good so far, and all the issues presented in things like Kenobi or Boba Fett just don't exist in this show. And I'm really happy to have it. I still need to get caught up though. I'm 1 or 2 eps. behind still.
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"I am the Outcast's Shadow" - Taegin Roan
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Lord_S_Gray
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« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2022, 05:32:30 AM »

Agree.

I think a comparison with Kenobi is warranted – I.e. compare the ‘heist’ in Andor to Kenobi infiltrating the Inquisition Fortress.

Andor – Small, sleepy outpost on a backwater world, cosmic event for cover added to this, several weeks of preparation, disguises, cover needed, internal help needed to get in – things still go wrong, they get some but not all they wanted, members of the team are killed, Imperials are responsive and quick to act when the breach is even suspected.

Kenobi – highly staffed Imperial Fortress arguably one of the most secure in the galaxy, full of Force sensitive Jedi hunters - Kenobi swims in, no disguise (apart from a rain coat over himself and Leia at one point), still gets what he was after, no injuries, escapes easily even after being found out and surrounded by storm troopers, with minimal help and seemingly minimal planning before hand.

Also looking at the characters, they all feel more realistic, e.g. Andor himself a small time wheeler and dealer on backwater world, looking for his sister initially, accidently kills two corporate guards, spends several episodes trying to get away for his own safety, all his actions and decisions (even bad ones) are to that end, uses his one valuable item to try and buy passage offworld.

These people make bad choices but only in keeping with their characters nature, jealousies and ambitions – so far no outright stupid decisions - they take risks, use their resources best they can, some win, and some lose very badly – but they all are working to their goals.

It’s certainly less action adventure and more drama, but all the better for it in my opinion, by far the deepest most grounded Star Wars canon media since Disney bought it.

I hope it keeps moving as it has been. As Taegin says its not everyone’s preference for Star Wars, but that’s fine, neither was Kenobi or Book of Boba Fett, I like they are trying something more serious and deep without resorting to calling back to popular characters or climatic battles.
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Lord_S_Gray

Surik: "Kreia, what are you—are you a Jedi, a Sith?"
Kreia: "Does it matter? Of course it does, such titles allow you to break the galaxy into light and dark, categorize it. Perhaps I am neither, and I hold both as what they are, pieces of a whole."

TheDutchman
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« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2022, 04:57:54 PM »

I also agree.

"Andor" is an example of how to do a character-driven story right.  Smart writing, realistic concerns and actions, and solid acting; the series is a compelling expansion on the story that we know (the Empire and the rise of the Rebel Alliance) while giving us fresh and new material. 

Part of the problem with the "Obi-Wan" series was its (over)use of contrivances and poor writing.  I, for one, actually do love fanservice...but it has to arise naturally within the story.  You don't have to sacrifice plotting just to have some fanservice twist, but the narrative should make sense, especially in context of the story.  Sure, some characters are going to have Plot Armor and that's not necessarily a bad thing.  Where I take umbrage is when either it's done so with a TON of contrivances OR bad writing (and stupid decisions).

As mentioned, "Andor" isn't everyone's cup of tea and there's nothing wrong with that (I have to admit that I really like tales with the Force in stories  Wink).  But I think that what makes "Andor" GOOD is the flow of the story, characters that aren't two-dimensional (even "bad guys" are given believable motives), and plotting that isn't just some slap-dash arrangement that strings lightsaber battles together to the next one.  And, again, this is coming from someone who LOVES lightsaber battles  Wink

I'm very interested in others' thoughts--good or bad--for Andor (great thread LSG)^^
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Lord_S_Gray
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« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2022, 11:09:43 PM »

Having now finished the series, I agree with Dutch this is a very different kind of series to the action adventure standard (though it still has elements of it), and much more character driven, some real depth given to the larger cast, Luthen especially had some incredible scene's where the price of his rebellion, and the impossible decisions with others lives he must make, upon his conscience is laid bare.

As Dutch notes every major character is multifaceted with credible motivations, talents and faults.

There were a few instances of possible 'teleporting' toward the end and some very convenient coincidences (notably post 'liberation'), but nothing that totally broke the suspension of disbelief entirely as was the case for me in Obi-Wan with t Reva, stabbed by a lightsabre, left for dead suddenly appearing on Tatooine.   

Overall I think this is by far the strongest series thus far, probably the best live action production (including the movies) since Disney took over to be honest, it goes deepest into characters lives, shows new places and factions in depth, and while certainly not perfect it was very consistent in quality throughout (more so than the Mandalorian which is a bit up and down between episodes). 

It benefited from a full 12 episode series and an excellent cast and direction to bring the story alive. 

Disney have now shown they can make this quality of show - we should expect no less from the next series/movies they produce.
 

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Lord_S_Gray

Surik: "Kreia, what are you—are you a Jedi, a Sith?"
Kreia: "Does it matter? Of course it does, such titles allow you to break the galaxy into light and dark, categorize it. Perhaps I am neither, and I hold both as what they are, pieces of a whole."

Taegin Roan
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« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2022, 06:56:03 PM »

I’ve also now finished the series, and loved it the entire way. But it’s important when going into it to have a different perspective on it. Don’t look at it as a Star Wars show, because it’s not. Star Wars is about the Force, the struggle between light and dark, and the not-so-blatant theming. All of which is great, and works perfectly for a Star Wars show. This was very much a science-fiction show. A sci-fi, character driven, slow-burn, thriller, that happens to be set in the Star Wars universe. And that’s awesome. But it’s important to know that going in.

There was very little in it that was there for the sake of “fan-service”, or convenience. Almost everything felt necessary and believable. The characters where all extremely strong. The locations were believable. The performances were top-knotch. The costuming was probably the best I’ve ever seen.

I noticed this myself, and have heard several others talk about it in regards to The Rings of Power, but in RoP, the Southlanders had no character or personality in their character design. No culture, as it were. Whereas you go to Ferrix (a rough equivalent) and you’re instantly immersed in that world’s culture. You can learn things about the characters and the world. Even in things like the rows of gloves hanging on the wall. And then towards the end, the different colored uniforms, and the bricks, and how that all affects things. Even the Anvil, and the various other clanging things (purposely keeping things vague because of spoilers, but if you’ve watched it, you know). It all comes together to build a believable and living environment in a way that is just about unmatched in any other show or movie in recent years.

So yeah, while it’s not really “Star Wars”, it’s still the best thing they’ve put out since Rogue One or TCW. Loving the discussion here guys. I’ve missed it.
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"I am the Outcast's Shadow" - Taegin Roan
"Confronting fear is the Destiny of a Jedi" - Luke Skywalker
"So this is how liberty dies: with thunderous applause." - Padmé Amidala

Lord Vaalic
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« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2023, 08:01:15 PM »

I loved this show. I thought it was some of the best Star Wars content ever. Yes, I get it will not be everyone's cup of tea, but I thought it was awesome. Shows the harder side of being a rebel, what it takes, what it meant. New characters, new locations. Politicking, personalities, etc. A lower pace yes, but well worth any fans time.

ON PROGRAM...
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There is no light side, there is no dark side. There is only the force. Jedi and Sith are two sides of the same coin. One paralyzed by fear of emotion, and one ruled and destroyed by it.

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