Practice Practice Practice

[ThreadJack]

That sounds cool mastrnick. Please post video of this tournament if/when it occurs.

[Darth Andronikus]

 that sounds awesome i would totally go to that tournament and i would think scoring it similar to the way epee fencing is scored would work fairly well ya know? full body but no head

[Novastar]

@MasterNick... sounds good, Nick!  If you have more details you'd like to share, feel free to PM me.

I will say... I want to try keeping things VERY simple, very straightforward & intuitive.  In my opinion... the most major "flaws" of sport sword arts today--would be the emphasis on having 6388742358 rules & regulations.  Fencing irritates me to no end these days, especially regarding the ambiguity that is rearing its ugly head regarding "right-of-way" (for foil & saber)... even compared to what the rulebooks still state... and Kendo drives me bonkers too, especially because there are SOOOOOOOO many "on-target" strikes that simply... uh... don't count.

Too many rules & regulations... simply (in MY opinion, and yes, I speak only for myself here!)... WASTE EVERYONE'S TIME.  Seriously who gives a rat's butt about 65,535 if you're just planning to do a friendly, but fun bout with LED sabers?  I don't have the time, inclination, or patience to bother wasting hours and hours of time upon overly-dramatic rules... just to score a 5 to 15 point bout!  Especially when it's all "for fun" anyhow.  I mean, really... even if you're a "gold medalist" in fencing or Kendo, etc. ... ... well... but what does it MEAN?!?!?  lol... that you could fend off the Zombie Hordes?? 

Anyhow... heheh... I'm hoping to keep things SIMPLE... yet somewhat "open to unique alteration" for special bouts.

[robgomm]

This is all sounding great guys. Can you imagine the day when we have a Lightsaber World Championship!

[Duff Man]

Ah yes, the good old point sparring system. If your opponent doesn't  acknowledge or the judges don't see it, it turns in to the "I Hit you, your dead" "No you didn't, I go my class two force field on"! That's we like to use the Instant Death/ Certain Death/ wound method with washable chalk.(different colors per person) Both you and your opponent know right away when and where you were hit and if they are fatal.  Yes it gets messy but it is really fun, that is until you look in the mirror and realize "Oh crap I am dead" or "30 sec bleed out....still dead, CRAP!"  and yes even "oh look I cut my own wrist....awesome"  Works well with rubber and wooden weapons, I am guessing it will probably stain the white blades though.

[Master BStone]

obviously there'd be some protective equipment standards...i think perhaps a subtly padded robe, similar to a gi, maybe with reinforced elbows and shoulders...a training regimen would include proper distance and control, further lessening the chance of injury.  i think head shots are perfectly justified;  theres plenty of precedent for armored clone trooper type helmets, or maybe fencing masks done up in a canon-type way..."with the blast shield down, i can't even see...how am i supposed to fight?"
counted blows might still be the best way to get the most enjoyment out of a lightsaber bout...but what if there was one hit only? double strikes = double defeat? hehe

[Novastar]

Right, a double-hit in a "one-hit, one kill" bout would either result in a double loss... or it simply would be thrown out. 

I'm not sure which I opt for, but... here's the thing--with the system I'd like to create (and hopefully try to EVENTUALLY promote it as a "good standard" for folks out there)... you could specify that a certain match be *ANY* of those things...

In other words, although it would be hard to "tally up" every nuance... what is stopping people from having FUN in saying, ok... today let's make it that ALL hits count, and if we double-hit in the "one-hit, one kill"... we BOTH LOSE.

Or another day/match/whatever--they throw the double hits out.  Slightly different bouting rules, and maybe the match type could be identified as such, and a DISTINCTION would be there (for record-keeping sake) of the match's specifics.

I'll have to explain more later, but... really... you guys might be surprised--I have this covered, and I think when I "unleash" the system... people will be *DOWN*... I think they'll love it, and with any luck... we could finally UNIFY folks with sparring and all that jazz!

[Manroon]

I am seriously loving this thread! I'm stoked for the sparring / match system Novastar is talking about, it sounds like it will be great to have even for those of us less likely to compete in the Lightsaber Category at the Olympics. XD

And all this talk of how one learns from sparring is most excellent! I'd also like to add in experience of my own. I've found when I spar with my friends, it's surprising how more often than not I find one or more of them have got some kind of training from somewhere. Often it's formal, sometimes it's more of a 'my brother took classes and he taught me a couple things', but either way, they often know some things. This means, of course, they pull a move from time to time that will lay me on my backside! What's great though is that equally often (after some laughing) they'll start teaching me the move they used, and the counters to it! You learn alot of interesting techniques that way, and it really expands your style. Especially if, say, I learned to fight via picking up on what I've seen used by others/on tv/in movies etc, and I fight a guy who is trained in Kendo. Then I fight another guy who is trained in fencing. I pick up moves from both, and maybe I pass those along to the other guy, and we expand our styles by adding in things we find usefull from each other. It's great! (Not to mention the look on an opponent's face when you start off two handed and suddenly switch to fencing tactics in the middle of a duel without a pause is PRICELESS)

[Duff Man]

That is why you shouldn't make fun of "Geeks". After years of abuse from the "cool" kids most of us become highly trained in some or another from of combat. (yes there is a little insight into my history)

[Novastar]

@Manroon... precisely!  With only a chosen few exceptions--most ALL training... is GOOD training.  Some more than others.  Sparring helps people to understand if what they have been doing is "bull-shido"... or really something APPLICABLE in any kind of "real-time" sport combat.

Another reason I hope to have "variants" on bouting will be to make certain than no one can simply get used to a particular ruleset... and then... after getting SO USED TO DOING IT... the mind starts to wander, thinking of ways to ABUSE that ruleset (in a point scoring system).

So... with any luck, there will be... how do I explain this... sort of "yes/no" variables that denote what type of sparring match was done.  If there are variables that are EXTREMELY rare or out-of-the-ordinary... they'll get marked as "wildcard" matches.  Again... hard to explain, but I think all will make sense in due time when I reveal it for DVD2 (and 3 & 4, etc.).

But really, I don't want to de-rail this thread too much.  Although I guess it's pretty open-ended.  PRACTICE, PRACTICE!!!

Something I'd like to say (in case other folks are new or unsure of such a thing)... you can *NEVER* do enough practicing of your FOUNDATIONAL, rudimentary basics.  In other words... just because you've thrown (let's say) side-kicks for 10 years... doesn't mean you "magically" get to stop practicing them.  I mean, I can't stop you from never practicing them.  But you should.

Same goes for sword-type motions / actions / "moves".  I mean... here's an example I just remembered--I watched a video interview of a national fencing champion from 2000 who was going to the Olympics.  They asked him "Now that you've made the Olympic team... is the training easier?  Do you surpass the basics and only practice new, complex moves?"...

And of course his answer was Ohhhhh H&&&&&&&&LLL no!!    He mentioned not being "satisfied" with his own LUNGE!!!  Which is--depending on how you look at it--one of the most foundational basic actions a fencer would be taught... from DAY ONE OF TRAINING.  Like when you took your first class... you probably learned about the lunge.

I could go on and on, but... I hope this is a lesson to ANYONE in that: YOU SHOULD NEVER ABANDON PRACTICING YOUR BASICS!!!  No, you are not "better" than your basics.  No, you are not "beyond them" now.  No, you are not so good at your basics that you should focus SOLELY on "super zorro ninja samurai" moves ... because chances are... the "super zorro ninja samurai" moves that you may seem to like so much... are PROBABLY just a combination of... ... THE BASICS!!!

So keep on practicing...

--Nova

[Master BStone]

i'd like to reiterate something Master Nova said about fundamentals and reinforcing them...in all levels of fencing, fundamentals and simplicity of tactic is usually what determines the outcome of a given confrontation.  you can never ever train your lunge, or basic footwork components enough! innovation occasionally scores touches, but strong, solid fundamentals honed through hours spent in the gym is what wins bouts, and eventually tournaments.

[RoryLyndze]

I agree with nova when i was in high school wresling thats what won basics but that just me

[Novastar]

Speaking of basics... let's consider something...

In almost all forms of martial art (ok, well, competitive "try to hit/get the other guy" martial arts--not just the personal/singular forms)... I can guarantee you that one of the most PARAMOUNT foundational building blocks (if not THE most paramount)... is "measure".

What does that mean.

Measure is simply the current distance between you and your opponent at any given time/moment.  It is SO crucially important (yet easy for beginners to miss or "ignore"), I cannot even begin to tell you what you'll discover about martial arts if you PAY ATTENTION TO YOUR MEASURE (or distance if you'd rather call it that).

Very little can be achieved unless the measure is properly addressed--in fact... "random sparring" will produce exactly that--randomness.  You will almost never know why you were--or why you were NOT--hit by an opponent.

I could go on for quite a bit here, but... it's something more to be seen vs. heard.

Here's a video where I show some of the most BASIC and RUDIMENTARY fencing actions... very "static" too, meaning with NO TRUE FOOTWORK.  Mainly... because the camera was in a fixed position, lol.    No cameraman = can't be moving around much, can we? 

http://www.youtube.com/user/TheCuttingEdgeSabre

The "Saber basics" video should autoplay on my channel... although you can watch more / all of the individual actions in the sidebar.

I could say a lot more, but... some of the concepts here will be seen in WAY more depth on NCSCS volume #2 and volume #3...

--Nova

[RoryLyndze]

And thats why i like 36in blades on my phantom v2 it gives me more reach i sack mobilty and it take more practice but it works for me. That remindes me be a ware of serounding my gf lyndze is and my frend kyle are having a hard time with this

[Novastar]

A really good point, Rory!  Generally, if you have two decently trained fighters, and one has a (let's say) 40" blade length whereas the other has a 34" blade length... that can tilt the balance in the favor of the owner of the longer blade.

Granted... sometimes 2" to 4" differences aren't the ONLY factor in having an advantages... but certainly if you pit a 26" blade vs. a 40" blade... it's sort of a no-brainer! 

Sort of like a dagger vs. a sword--pretty obvious who has a GREAT advantage...