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Author Topic: Trustfire Battery Issue  (Read 69150 times)
Drahcir
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« Reply #45 on: August 17, 2015, 07:18:14 AM »

Yup, I always knew that a lot of batteries that can be found cheaper are falsely advertised. It's nice to have actual proof of that rather than hear-say
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« Reply #46 on: August 17, 2015, 03:47:08 PM »

Ultrafire batteries are pretty well know these days for having waaaaaay lower capacity than stated. Trustfire is pretty decent for 14500, but if you want to get real good capacity and discharge rates, go Nitecore.
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Schtuperman
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« Reply #47 on: August 18, 2015, 11:11:13 AM »

GPL 14500 Li-ion "2300 Mah" Test:

Received 8 complimentary evaluation samples of a vender's "best" 14500 Li-ion cells.  Cells branded "GPL."  No mention of a protection circuit on the labeling. The strange part is the claimed capacity - 2300 Mah!  Uh huh...   Roll Eyes  Tested four of them last night.   Fully charged four cells in a Klarus CH4S Digital Charger.  The CH4S charges the cells individually @ .5 amp per cell.  All tests were run on my GB Raven with Obsidian 2.0 sitting statically.

Within 15 minutes the blade dimmed significantly.  At 20 mins the blade was flickering badly.  By 23 minutes the blade was out completely.  Recharged & repeated the test twice with 2 pairs of cells.  Both sets & runs had identical results.  Here is the laughable part.  Observe how much charge the "2300" Mah cells actually accepted during the recharge cycle (the smaller number below the cell voltage):

Summary: The GTL cells are junk.  Only one cells accepted even 300 Mah hours of charge!  2000 Mah BELOW the claimed capacity.  In reality these cells should be rated at 300-400 Mah and that's being generous.







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Sarich Belmont
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« Reply #48 on: August 18, 2015, 02:37:42 PM »

I would like to add, any 14500 cell that claims to have more than 900mah is lying, straight up. 2300mah is something you can only get out of an 18650.
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Schtuperman
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« Reply #49 on: August 18, 2015, 08:02:51 PM »

.. if you want to get real good capacity and discharge rates, go Nitecore.

NiteCores are nice.  I only see them in 650/750 capacity, and they are pricey.  Couldn't find anyplace selling them in bulk & they were around $6.50/cell.  Expensive if you need 40!  I just ordered 40 genuine TrustFire 900s with PCB for $64 delivered.
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Sarich Belmont
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« Reply #50 on: August 18, 2015, 09:47:47 PM »

Capacity isn't really the biggest of issues, it's more about how well a battery can discharge power. Nitecore does it far better than Trustfire can, which allows for a more even discharge curve and potentially a brighter blade. Though I do agree if you need a lot Trustfire is a better option, but if you have a special one off build in the future, which I do, I'm gonna shell out for the Panasonic or Nitecore 18650.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2015, 09:59:25 PM by Sarich Belmont » Logged

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« Reply #51 on: August 23, 2015, 03:26:31 PM »

Out of curiosity have you actually tried Nitecores in a saber?  Asking because in all the reviews I see a lot of complaints about them being longer than most 14500s and people having difficulty fitting them in many devices.  Was considering ordering a couple of pairs for testing.
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Schtuperman
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« Reply #52 on: August 23, 2015, 04:22:41 PM »

Replacement Batteries - Buyer Beware!

As you have probably noticed I have been seeking replacement cells for my sabers.

As originally equipped, my sabers came with TrustFire 900s.  The cells contain protection PCBs that shut the cells down at overcurrent or low-voltage.  I get ~50 minutes of run time with these (Guardian blue, Obsidian, lighted AV - this is my test bench saber).  Red sabers should last longer as the LED requires less power.  Generally the blade remains near fully illuminated until shutdown, except for mixed colors like Hot Pink or Violet Amethyst where the blue LED shuts down first.   TrustFire 900s seem to realistically provide 750-800 mAh of capacity.

I have since tried UltraFire 1200s.  At .99/cell they are certainly cheap.  They do NOT contain protection PCBs (though the labeling claims they do) and realistically these should only be rated at 300-350 mAh.  They will run a saber for ~12-15 minutes at full brightness.  Thereafter the blade dims noticeably before flickering and extinguishing completely.  As there are no protection PCBs (or they are non-functional...haven't dissassembled a cell to check) the cells will continue to provide power until they get to absolute zero.  Not good for a Li-ion cell.  All 40 cells are functional.  Realistically the UltraFire 1200s should be rated at 350-400 mAh.

I tried a complimentary 8-pack of "GTL 2300s"   All worked but these are a total waste of time & should be rated at perhaps 300 mAh if feeling generous.  

Yesterday I received 40 gray-wrapper "Protected TrustFire 900s" from a vendor.  Price was excellent....$64 for 40 cells delivered.  Before I placed the order I wrote the vendor and specifically asked, "Are these genuine protected-mode TrustFire 900s?  I will return them if they are knockoffs."  I was assured they were genuine & he offers a 60-day return if not satisfied.   I opened the package to find the cells packed in boxes of 8 cells each with each cell individual boxed within. As soon as I opened the first one I knew they were counterfeit.  Labeling doesn't match a genuine TrustFire and no vents on the anodes.  

I decided to open 6 cells and performed 3 runtime tests on my test saber.  Before testing I charged the 6 cells in my Klarus CH4S digital charger.   I wasn't expecting much as 2 of the cells indicated FULL when connected to the charger and would accept no charge.  In the three tests performed I got 10-12 minutes of full brightness.  By 15 minutes the blade was considerably dimmed & flickering & by 18-20 minutes the blade was fully extinguished.   There is no protection PCB in these cells so they do not shut down.

Upon recharging, 2 of 6 cells failed to charge, showing only 1.38 & 2.21 volts respectively (the charger actually identifies the failed cells as Ni-MH cells due to the voltage).  That is a failure rate of 33%!   The remaining 4 cells accepted only 215-333 mA of charge.  More counterfeit junk that I will be returning.  I rate them at 300 mAh, but the 33% failure rate is abysmal & totally unacceptable. 

If you want a chuckle, when I wrote the guy requesting a return his initial reply was, "You can't judge a battery by how long it runs or how much charge it accepts."   Roll Eyes   I replied "Whatever!  Just tell me how to return them!"  


In summary, Buyer Beware when seeking replacement cells.  Amazon & ebay both are filled with "deals" offering counterfeit cells or batteries with grossly overstated & unrealistic claims of capacity.  If I didn't need 40 all at once I would have just ordered them here at US initially.  Looks like that's what I'll be doing afterall!  In the photos you can see the fake "TrustFire 900s" in banks 1 & 4 have failed.  A pair of genuine TrustFires were charged for comparison, though they weren't fully depleted before the charge cycle.








« Last Edit: August 23, 2015, 04:32:49 PM by Schtuperman » Logged

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Dark War Glaive: PO/AS
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Sarich Belmont
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« Reply #53 on: August 25, 2015, 02:13:41 PM »

Out of curiosity have you actually tried Nitecores in a saber?  Asking because in all the reviews I see a lot of complaints about them being longer than most 14500s and people having difficulty fitting them in many devices.  Was considering ordering a couple of pairs for testing.

I've never used the 14500 sized cells, but I have used the 18650s. It was for a sink tube stunt I made for a friend. I swear that battery just refused to drain for the longest time.
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« Reply #54 on: August 30, 2015, 02:06:45 PM »

Friday I was surprised to receive an unexpected package from the ebay vendor who sold me the "genuine" TrustFire 900s that turned out to be cheap counterfeits.  Inside was a letter apologizing and 20 small boxes.  Inside each box was a pair of genuine (seriously) TrustFire 900 protected cells, shrink-wrapped together with a holographic seal of authenticity.





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Shock LE: AS/AB
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Crimson Reaper: (x2) SY/AS-AS/BR
Dark Arbiter: CG/AS
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Dark Standard: AS/BR
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Groovidad
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« Reply #55 on: August 31, 2015, 07:12:41 PM »

Friday I was surprised to receive an unexpected package from the ebay vendor who sold me the "genuine" TrustFire 900s that turned out to be cheap counterfeits.  Inside was a letter apologizing and 20 small boxes.  Inside each box was a pair of genuine (seriously) TrustFire 900 protected cells, shrink-wrapped together with a holographic seal of authenticity.







WoW!  Well I know someone is going to be busy testing! Wink
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« Reply #56 on: September 18, 2015, 12:04:06 PM »

I've asked before, and had created a thread for it, but never got anywhere.

Does anyone know an actual Brick and Mortar (physical location) store chain that sells the Li-Ion cells for our sabers?

I don't want to end up going through ebay and amazon vendors, for fear of counterfeits and damaging my saber, but I just want a couple of cells for one saber and paying the $20 in shipping hurts...

I do keep toying with adding other parts to try and justify it, but my wife tends to become Sith-like when I make the bill skyrocket and we have other bills to pay like the house, car, utilities, etc.
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« Reply #57 on: September 18, 2015, 03:50:15 PM »

Does anyone know an actual Brick and Mortar (physical location) store chain that sells the Li-Ion cells for our sabers?

Radio Shack's back in business and stocking Lithium Ion rechargeables in different sizes. The person working the shop when I came in didn't really know anything about lithium ions (pointing me to those regular 1.5v "lithium" batteries), but then made mention of a section of batteries that were popular with Vapers, and surprise, a whole selection of 14500, 18650, and lots of other size rechargeable lithium-ion batteries. The one by me only carries 14500s in a pack with a charger, but that set is also currently on clearance, so you might score yourself a nice deal.
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« Reply #58 on: September 19, 2015, 02:09:59 AM »

Radio Shack's back in business and stocking Lithium Ion rechargeables in different sizes. The person working the shop when I came in didn't really know anything about lithium ions (pointing me to those regular 1.5v "lithium" batteries), but then made mention of a section of batteries that were popular with Vapers, and surprise, a whole selection of 14500, 18650, and lots of other size rechargeable lithium-ion batteries. The one by me only carries 14500s in a pack with a charger, but that set is also currently on clearance, so you might score yourself a nice deal.

Hit up the nearest Radio Shack, found some 14500, 750mAh, 3.7 v Li-Ions... like you said, came with a charger, but failed to pay attention to the fact that I need a micro-USB cable to hook up the charger.  So now I need to dig through my old phone chargers to see if I still have one that works, since switching to iPhones, we all have lightning chargers now.  Got two, two packs, with chargers, for $32.00, first one was $19.99, second, because of a clearance sale, was half off.

Once I get them charged, we'll see how they do.

Brand is DE?  (www.DEWORLD.com)
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« Reply #59 on: September 19, 2015, 02:28:56 AM »

That info would be great to know.  I think that Radio Shack stores are slowing closing down in Canada as seem to be scarce.  The Source stores also sell LI-Ion batteries but did not have a TrustFire with me to compare.  Also the clerk did not seem to know much about them.   Smiley
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