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Author Topic: Kendo  (Read 3960 times)
SirLiftaLot
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« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2021, 12:27:54 AM »

As I recall kendo is one of the last remaining representations of the culture of the Samurai of Japan. It preserves their skill at swordplay. And thus is a good sport for those that long to learn the art of the sword. It was developed from kenjustu, the Japanese art of swordplay. Swordsmen established the schools of kenjustu and developed things called katas as a way of honing their skills with the sword. Or so I've read. I believe that kata is simply a form, like the various lightsaber forms. So there were different katas to master.

In my experience (Taekwondo) a form is not a style of combat like it is with lightsabers in Star Wars, but more of a sequence of moves that serves as practice. A choreographed sequence of moves.

In this clip from Rebels, you can see Anakin performing a sequence of moves to a count (you hear him counting one, two, etc.). This could just be a drill with a series of moves, but that's still fairly similar to a form, or kata, where you perform a sequence or series of moves, often with a common theme throughout, to help teach and practice a given skill, movement, or idea.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmaKSXWWq6A" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmaKSXWWq6A</a>


Certain forms/katas can of course be more or less useful for a given from/style of lightsaber combat, with different moves, pacing, speed, etc. but you can practice many different forms/katas all with the same form/style of combat, if that makes any sense.

As for the various lightsaber forms, it does make sense that one would adopt a style suited to their skills, or even adapt a style further to play to their strengths and minimize their weaknesses. We see Vader and Savage use their strength for example, while Maul and Ahsoka use their athleticism in combat.
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"He who conquers himself is greater than another who conquers a thousand times a thousand men."

"Research your own experience. Absorb what is useful, reject what is useless, add what is essentially your own." -Bruce Lee

Hulk10
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Force Outcast Juggernaut


« Reply #16 on: February 01, 2021, 02:44:30 AM »

In my experience (Taekwondo) a form is not a style of combat like it is with lightsabers in Star Wars, but more of a sequence of moves that serves as practice. A choreographed sequence of moves.

In this clip from Rebels, you can see Anakin performing a sequence of moves to a count (you hear him counting one, two, etc.). This could just be a drill with a series of moves, but that's still fairly similar to a form, or kata, where you perform a sequence or series of moves, often with a common theme throughout, to help teach and practice a given skill, movement, or idea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmaKSXWWq6A#

Certain forms/katas can of course be more or less useful for a given from/style of lightsaber combat, with different moves, pacing, speed, etc. but you can practice many different forms/katas all with the same form/style of combat, if that makes any sense.

As for the various lightsaber forms, it does make sense that one would adopt a style suited to their skills, or even adapt a style further to play to their strengths and minimize their weaknesses. We see Vader and Savage use their strength for example, while Maul and Ahsoka use their athleticism in combat.


Indeed. In martial arts we are taught to not resist what we cannot change so we have to use our gifts.  Vader couldn't use agility like he could as Anakin Skywalker, but he could use strength and durability.  In the Inheritance Cycle books by Christopher Paolini, the dragon Glaedr once said. "The warrior that adapts the quickest, lives the longest." By which I believe he meant that if you can adapt quicker to a changing situation you will last longer.
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SirLiftaLot
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Force Alignment: 134
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« Reply #17 on: February 01, 2021, 02:51:57 AM »

Indeed. In martial arts we are taught to not resist what we cannot change so we have to use our gifts.  Vader couldn't use agility like he could as Anakin Skywalker, but he could use strength and durability.  In the Inheritance Cycle books by Christopher Paolini, the dragon Glaedr once said. "The warrior that adapts the quickest, lives the longest." By which I believe he meant that if you can adapt quicker to a changing situation you will last longer.
Good quote. That reminds me of something Bruce Lee said. "Notice that the stiffest tree is most easily cracked, while the bamboo or willow survives by bending with the wind."
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"He who conquers himself is greater than another who conquers a thousand times a thousand men."

"Research your own experience. Absorb what is useful, reject what is useless, add what is essentially your own." -Bruce Lee

DarthProdigal
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« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2021, 02:52:53 AM »

Sadly I only took afterschool tai kwon do and so my knowledge of this is limited. But I do have an appreciation for different styles. Yeah I agree the thing I noticed is that with lightsaber dueling, they don't seem to care much if you experiment with your lightsaber skills. Once you learn the Forms you are free to experiment and invent. I rather like that. And we see that in Darth Vader, he modified his fighting style to match being heavier and less agile due to his suit. And he became an absolutely lethal fighter. Bariss Offee pointed out to Ahsoka that she favored a form of Djem So, but suggested  Form VI as being more effective in combat against her.

In my experience (Taekwondo) a form is not a style of combat like it is with lightsabers in Star Wars, but more of a sequence of moves that serves as practice. A choreographed sequence of moves.

In this clip from Rebels, you can see Anakin performing a sequence of moves to a count (you hear him counting one, two, etc.). This could just be a drill with a series of moves, but that's still fairly similar to a form, or kata, where you perform a sequence or series of moves, often with a common theme throughout, to help teach and practice a given skill, movement, or idea.

Certain forms/katas can of course be more or less useful for a given from/style of lightsaber combat, with different moves, pacing, speed, etc. but you can practice many different forms/katas all with the same form/style of combat, if that makes any sense.

As for the various lightsaber forms, it does make sense that one would adopt a style suited to their skills, or even adapt a style further to play to their strengths and minimize their weaknesses. We see Vader and Savage use their strength for example, while Maul and Ahsoka use their athleticism in combat.

I entered into Taekwondo quite some time after beginning and becoming very familiarized/regimented in kendo, and I at first gravitated more towards Kumdo. I enjoyed using the same gear in that respect. Although the two are (at least in my experience) rather different in ways, reflecting the origins in different cultures but also the differences in style. I thoroughly enjoyed taekwondo for many reasons, but (and possibly just due to the fact it was a different instructor and/or "school") it always struck me as markedly more aggressive. The two also of course had completely different names/terms since they were grounded in very different languages. It was a wonderous growth experience, but at first rather disorienting to relearn new titles for everything. Though yes, I did love almost all of the forms (the drills of movements) in it! They made me think heavily of kenjutsu when using a sword, because everything was so geared toward interesting movements and attack patterns from the get go especially in multiple directions and vs multiple envisioned opponents. Kumdo seemed in many respects a far cry from Kendo, but previous training prepared me to pick it up faster and made it very rewarding. I'd also call it a good basis for lightsaber training, just like the Bo staff was great fundamentally towards the saberstaff. Not to mention all the taekwondo kicks that (as SirLift would surely say) could theoretically be useful in true lightsaber combat. Martial Arts are truly fantastic, and those times will always have such meaning for me. But Kendo will always hold a special place in my heart.

Even though I've learned so many things since the first bits, it's like JoleeBindo referenced "the skills are perishable, and rust accumulates" but I've found the mechanics tend to stay the same under it all. Finite motor control may not guide the blade right back at first with pinpoint precision, but the pieces remain just waiting to be put back together. A body never fully forgets those things etched into it, when carved deep enough through endless repetitions. I always find myself snapping back into it remarkably fast, but I suppose I've rarely allowed myself to be "fully out of practice" or abandon the mindset entirely. It just runs too deeply, and a sword of some sort is rarely far away. We all have our passions... and through passion I gain strength.

I must agree with the ideology of adaptability. I've tried to mirror Bruce Lee in adapting my personal fighting style or variations as need arises. I like both of your mindsets there. I've learned much all to find what works best for my body type, the variety of situations our world generates, and my own preferences. Such a thing is by no means easy, but is a worthy effort of a lifetime in my way of thinking. Never regretted the effort even once. MA are truly meaningful.
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JoleeBindo
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« Reply #19 on: February 01, 2021, 09:51:49 PM »

I entered into Taekwondo quite some time after beginning and becoming very familiarized/regimented in kendo, and I at first gravitated more towards Kumdo. I enjoyed using the same gear in that respect. Although the two are (at least in my experience) rather different in ways, reflecting the origins in different cultures but also the differences in style. I thoroughly enjoyed taekwondo for many reasons, but (and possibly just due to the fact it was a different instructor and/or "school") it always struck me as markedly more aggressive. The two also of course had completely different names/terms since they were grounded in very different languages. It was a wonderous growth experience, but at first rather disorienting to relearn new titles for everything. Though yes, I did love almost all of the forms (the drills of movements) in it! They made me think heavily of kenjutsu when using a sword, because everything was so geared toward interesting movements and attack patterns from the get go especially in multiple directions and vs multiple envisioned opponents. Kumdo seemed in many respects a far cry from Kendo, but previous training prepared me to pick it up faster and made it very rewarding. I'd also call it a good basis for lightsaber training, just like the Bo staff was great fundamentally towards the saberstaff. Not to mention all the taekwondo kicks that (as SirLift would surely say) could theoretically be useful in true lightsaber combat. Martial Arts are truly fantastic, and those times will always have such meaning for me. But Kendo will always hold a special place in my heart.

Even though I've learned so many things since the first bits, it's like JoleeBindo referenced "the skills are perishable, and rust accumulates" but I've found the mechanics tend to stay the same under it all. Finite motor control may not guide the blade right back at first with pinpoint precision, but the pieces remain just waiting to be put back together. A body never fully forgets those things etched into it, when carved deep enough through endless repetitions. I always find myself snapping back into it remarkably fast, but I suppose I've rarely allowed myself to be "fully out of practice" or abandon the mindset entirely. It just runs too deeply, and a sword of some sort is rarely far away. We all have our passions... and through passion I gain strength.

I must agree with the ideology of adaptability. I've tried to mirror Bruce Lee in adapting my personal fighting style or variations as need arises. I like both of your mindsets there. I've learned much all to find what works best for my body type, the variety of situations our world generates, and my own preferences. Such a thing is by no means easy, but is a worthy effort of a lifetime in my way of thinking. Never regretted the effort even once. MA are truly meaningful.

Kumdo test cutting and Shinkendo tameshigiri always seemed so close as to be fraternal twins. The geometry of Kumdo's blade are alittle different (being what the Japanese would call Hira-zukuri, and don't have much of a secondary bevel, being basically one plane from the spine to the edge). I LOVE their complete commitment to their moves, and their footwork is so aggressively dynamic that it's like watching a tiger go after it's prey.  I have never studied Tae Kwon Do, but did study Chito-ryu Karate in addition to Kenjutsu. (For some reason it won't let me put an S instead of a C in the name of that Karate style, the forum kept calling it Shello-ryu)  I will chime in that empty hand training, paired with auxillary weapon training (tonfa, sai, bo, nunchaku, etc), further mixed with katana and wakizashi.....if you can't be like water, you're going to be like a stick in the mud.  Variety is the spice of life, and the spice of MA, in my opinion.

Jun Fan Jeet Kune Do is an incredible art, and the "mule kick" executed by Sifu Lee is a terrifying weapon in anyone's arsenal.  Danny Inosanto brought such an amazing synthesis of escrima to JKD, too. I studied JKD under a martial arts instructor who also taught escrima, and I still have a great love for Filipino bladework.  I feel that as martial artists we owe much to these men for the groundbeaking, tradition-shattering research they did. At great personal cost to themselves.

There aren't many martial arts that I have encountered that I wasn't delighted to study to at least some degree, and add pieces to my toolbox.  I am a lifelong student, and certainly not a master of any of the arts. Well, maybe the art of making a sandwich or some such thing, but certainly not of the arts martial. Grumpy old outcast Jedi, out.
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