Random Star Wars Thoughts

[Darth Logos]

Well I'm a huge Sabine fan, what happened is... she got the dark saber. End of story. That's it. She got the ds so they started training her even though there was not a single hint of force sensibility. Kid is rewatching the whole show, so I'll watch closely for any force sensitivity...

Actually, now that I think on it, it was that whole detestable notion that you could feel the weight of the blade....IT F@#$ING PLASMA!!!!!!!!!!!!! The blade has a total weight of .1% of a mosquito wing. No one is ever going to be able to physically feel its weight. Darth Tepes and I locked horns in discussing this in the SWR threads many years ago. I conceded to his logic of a Force-sensitive being able to perceive the weight, seeing as how plasma, by definition is merely super-heated air, and therefore does have a mass that can be felt through the Force. But ever since that gem from F-Up Filoni they've been pushing this crap. Case in point: Sith sabers are "heavier" (which makes no sense because according to DSW's bull$#!% lore, the Sith have to take their crystals from Jedi and.....<braces> bleed them <barf>. So they should be the same weight) Another flatulent example was in BoBF when Dim Bulb gets kincked out of the cult. The DS " resisted him, and he was flinginig it around like it weighed 50lbs. Disney-era Lucasfilm is staffed with incompetance.

Funny I never interpreted the last Chirut scene as him being guided by the force, I just saw a man sacrificing himself for the mission.

It was heavily implied because

a) he was in unfamiliar territory and trying to find something of indeterminate size.
b) it was a frikkin war zone, so...chaos
c) he made it to the target unscathed

Yes he made the sacfrifce play, but a blind man in a war zone succeeding? That's like firing a torp from Yavin IV orbit slingshotting it around the star, nothing but net into the exhaust port.

Can we please all agree the sequels never existed? pretty please? no? damn it.

The sequels never existed. It's all a fever dream. The last SW movie was released in 2005.

[TheDutchman]

The sequels never existed. It's all a fever dream. The last SW movie was released in 2005.

THIS^^

[DarthRondoudou]

Actually, now that I think on it, it was that whole detestable notion that you could feel the weight of the blade....IT F@#$ING PLASMA!!!!!!!!!!!!! The blade has a total weight of .1% of a mosquito wing. No one is ever going to be able to physically feel its weight. Darth Tepes and I locked horns in discussing this in the SWR threads many years ago. I conceded to his logic of a Force-sensitive being able to perceive the weight, seeing as how plasma, by definition is merely super-heated air, and therefore does have a mass that can be felt through the Force. But ever since that gem from F-Up Filoni they've been pushing this crap. Case in point: Sith sabers are "heavier" (which makes no sense because according to DSW's bull$#!% lore, the Sith have to take their crystals from Jedi and.....<braces> bleed them <barf>. So they should be the same weight) Another flatulent example was in BoBF when Dim Bulb gets kincked out of the cult. The DS " resisted him, and he was flinginig it around like it weighed 50lbs. Disney-era Lucasfilm is staffed with incompetance.
It was heavily implied because

a) he was in unfamiliar territory and trying to find something of indeterminate size.
b) it was a frikkin war zone, so...chaos
c) he made it to the target unscathed

Yes he made the sacfrifce play, but a blind man in a war zone succeeding? That's like firing a torp from Yavin IV orbit slingshotting it around the star, nothing but net into the exhaust port.
The sequels never existed. It's all a fever dream. The last SW movie was released in 2005.

The weight thing drives me mad too. I like Mando and most of Boba. BUT THIS SCENE UGH. One could possibly argue that the DS being weird might, and it's a huuuuuge might, have a different behaviour. Like dark matter/black hole gravity weirdness going on with it.
But this stupid idea of weight is what ruined the one and only thing I could have possibly enjoyed from the sequels. The lightsaber fights. They were awful. Period. And ridicule. So yeah. Agreed.

Well we don't know much about Chirut, how long he's been blind, what he could or could not do etc. Him being sensitive is implied so maybe he can feel stuff but isn't sensitive enough to be trained. Although if you need to think that hard about a scene, it could mean it was badly done. and written. I would have much prefered he was a jedi all along and ignited a lightspear at that point. Missed opportunity.

Yeah. F the sequels.

[Darth Logos]

The weight thing drives me mad too. I like Mando and most of Boba. BUT THIS SCENE UGH. One could possibly argue that the DS being weird might, and it's a huuuuuge might, have a different behaviour. Like dark matter/black hole gravity weirdness going on with it.
But this stupid idea of weight is what ruined the one and only thing I could have possibly enjoyed from the sequels. The lightsaber fights. They were awful. Period. And ridicule. So yeah. Agreed.

Well we don't know much about Chirut, how long he's been blind, what he could or could not do etc. Him being sensitive is implied so maybe he can feel stuff but isn't sensitive enough to be trained. Although if you need to think that hard about a scene, it could mean it was badly done. and written. I would have much prefered he was a jedi all along and ignited a lightspear at that point. Missed opportunity.

Yeah. F the sequels.

NO. The whole of the dark saber was trash from the get-go. F-up Filoni heard that they made a black blade skin in TFU, and had to rip it off. Why else do you think that it had to be associated with a Mandalorian Jedi. Not a terribly original idea considering Mandalore isn't known for having Force sensitives, so let's make the idea even more ridiculous by having this one outlier be even more weird by a) having a black blade, and b) having it be shaped. It was dumb. Now if they wanted to go off the angle that coming from a warrior culture gave this individual a leg up in producing a singularly powerful saber, sure. (I've worked out, what I believe, to be a perfectly rational science to explain how a black blade is produced.) But worse still, is that this idiotic notion has to work its way back into the fabric of Mando culture to that level.....too contrived.

There is however 1 aspect we haven't looked at concerning Chirrut: he's blind. Being blind, he perceives the world differently, and may make him slightly more aware of the Force's influence. $10 says that this was solely based on the member-berries of "Your eyes can deceive you. Don't trust them." All in all, I still don't like it that much because it furthers the BS of "the will of the Force."

HA! Fs in the chat for SW.

[Taegin Roan]

I'mma go a bit different direction and say I like Chirrut and that he has some very limited abilities with the Force. Why? Because it makes for a good story, and it solidifies his character arc through the movie. Plus it's fantasy, not Sci-Fi. So I totally buy it. Also same reason I don't hate the Dark Saber. Sabine, on the other hand... that's not good storytelling. I thought she was great in Rebels, but I don't feel like the live-action has done any favors to any of the characters from Rebels.

[Darth Logos]

I'mma go a bit different direction and say I like Chirrut and that he has some very limited abilities with the Force. Why? Because it makes for a good story, and it solidifies his character arc through the movie. Plus it's fantasy, not Sci-Fi. So I totally buy it. Also same reason I don't hate the Dark Saber. Sabine, on the other hand... that's not good storytelling. I thought she was great in Rebels, but I don't feel like the live-action has done any favors to any of the characters from Rebels.

Don't get me wrong, I think Chirrut was mainly there to be the Force representative without being Jedi. That said, I also think that he tied in with that barf-tastic cult of Force worshipers on Jakku, and the notion that the Force is parallel to a conscious deity is dumb.

I'm also going fight you on fantasy v. sci-fi. Star Wars is one of, if not the greatest of the hybrid universes. The Force is a great gimmick mechanic to showcase incredible feats, but most of the universe is based in science. That's one of the reasons why varying technologies are shown so prevalently throughout.

Droids: not magic
Spaceships: not magic
Hyperspace: not magic
Blasters: not magic
Lightsabers: not magic

The list can go on and on. The problem is that Disney got their grubby paws on it and, well.....let's just say they don't have a good track record (especially in recent years) in not being deluded (or diluted) in fantasy. They did pretty good for a long time dealing in magic. Star Wars isn't about magic, therefore it's not fantasy, but that's what they keep trying to make it (along with other crap) and it just doesn't work.

Sabine was by and large originally F-up Filoni giving us member berries ("member Mandolorians?"). A little cringe at the beginning, but was eventually fleshed out. Kinda like Ahsoka in the beginning of TCW. She was functional as the demolisions expert on the team, explosive both artistically and tactically. But of course, we need more girl bosses to lead the men around, and then she has to be "Force sensative".

[Darth Tepes]

NO. The whole of the dark saber was trash from the get-go. F-up Filoni heard that they made a black blade skin in TFU, and had to rip it off. Why else do you think that it had to be associated with a Mandalorian Jedi.

Point of Order:  Filoni actually had Pre using an old Vibro-Blade that a Mando created that was stronger against Sabers than the others.  But after the animations had already been made Lucas saw it and said "Nope got to be a saber".  So there was a scramble to fix it without scrapping all the work.  I let a lot go about the Dark Saber because I knew why it was there.  Having it be "heavier" was a good idea I thought because it was older.  Kanan talking about the magnetic pull between two sabers also helped (imo) the weight argument.  But the whole thing with it being heavy for Mando to use because of whatever was getting too much.  But the DS is gone now.

Though the idea of One Mando having been a Jedi is intriguing and I would love to see actually fleshed out.

[Darth Logos]

Point of Order:  Filoni actually had Pre using an old Vibro-Blade that a Mando created that was stronger against Sabers than the others.  But after the animations had already been made Lucas saw it and said "Nope got to be a saber".  So there was a scramble to fix it without scrapping all the work.  I let a lot go about the Dark Saber because I knew why it was there.

Alright, I'll apologize for slandering Filoni for that. A beskar vibro-blade would have made infinitely better sense. It would have explained the shape and the weight, ntm the noise.

"Having it be "heavier" was a good idea I thought because it was older.  Kanan talking about the magnetic pull between two sabers also helped (imo) the weight argument.  But the whole thing with it being heavy for Mando to use because of whatever was getting too much.

[/quote]
Still no. I liked your idea of a Force sensitive being able to perceive the weight of plasma, but for it to actually have enough weight to offer resistance to muscle is dumb. That's like saying a torch gets heavier when it's lit.

But the DS is gone now.

HUH?!?! Also, destroying/losing it doesn't edit it out of canon.

Though the idea of One Mando having been a Jedi is intriguing and I would love to see actually fleshed out.

Which they then had to make less remarkable by making Sabine a sensitive.


ALSO.....good to see you, stranger.

[Darth Tepes]

Still no. I liked your idea of a Force sensitive being able to perceive the weight of plasma, but for it to actually have enough weight to offer resistance to muscle is dumb. That's like saying a torch gets heavier when it's lit.

I meant in terms of the hilt maybe being heavier than newer sabers.  But I will say while a torch doesn't get heavier it will push of course since its basically and afterburner.  Why when I "ignite" a saber I drop my hand a bit like it was pushed down.

Which they then had to make less remarkable by making Sabine a sensitive.

Sabine IS a descendent of Tarre Viszla... but I wasn't much on her being force sensitive either.


Good to see yall to.  I often think about the forum and then life gets back in the way. 

[Darth Logos]

I meant in terms of the hilt maybe being heavier than newer sabers.  But I will say while a torch doesn't get heavier it will push of course since its basically and afterburner.  Why when I "ignite" a saber I drop my hand a bit like it was pushed down.

HUH? I always took Kanan's BS explanation to mean the blades pull (which is beyond dumb). No one usually references the hilt when talking about saber lore; the blade/crystal is always the focus.

Sabine IS a descendent of Tarre Viszla... but I wasn't much on her being force sensitive either.

Meh. Is it document that Tarre had kids? Hard to have descendants with no kids and the Jedi prolly would have been sticklers about such things 1050 BBY.

Sidenote: F@#$!!! I was really hoping (although I hate it) that the DS would have gone back further to the Old Republic era. Kinda wanted to use it (or rather a less dumb idea of it) as a pseudo-McGuffin for my Sith story.

Good to see yall to.  I often think about the forum and then life gets back in the way. 

As stated before, I long for the good old days when this place was jumping.

[Darth Tepes]

Meh. Is it document that Tarre had kids? Hard to have descendants with no kids and the Jedi prolly would have been sticklers about such things 1050 BBY.

Pre Viszla was In the Clone Wars with the DS.  Then Paz Viszla was in The Mandalorian. the one Favereu played.  He wanted the DS as it was his Ancestors. Sabine isn't a direct descendant but is part of Clan Viszla.
deceived
Filoni snuck in Old Republic Lore with Pre saying his ancestor liberated the DS from the Temple during the Sacking of Courscant.  That is the Old Republic "Deceived" trailer.  The Redhead Mando in that trailer...Was Shae Viszla.  Disney Lore says "it was created SOMETIME  BEFORE  1000 bby"  Could easily mesh that with SWTOR Canon to have the DS be a relic.

[Darth Logos]

Pre Viszla was In the Clone Wars with the DS.  Then Paz Viszla was in The Mandalorian. the one Favereu played.  He wanted the DS as it was his Ancestor's. Sabine isn't a direct descendant but is part of Clan Viszla.
deceived
Filoni snuck in Old Republic Lore with Pre saying his ancestor liberated the DS from the Temple during the Sacking of Courscant.  That is the Old Republic "Deceived" trailer.  The Redhead Mando in that trailer...Was Shae Viszla.  Disney Lore says "it was created SOMETIME  BEFORE  1000 bby"  Could easily mesh that with SWTOR Canon to have the DS be a relic.

Correction: the one Favreau voiced. The physical presence was performed by Tait Fletcher.

I know that Sabine is Clan Vizsla, because she says it when she claims why she has a right to the saber. My question is did Tarre have actual descendants? And then the seemingly moronic history of the saber goes further down into the muck when you think the Jedi aren't just going to hand over a saber to his surviving family because....(<nerd voice>well Anakin's saber was passed down to his son). The son he wasn't supposed to have, who was given the saber from the man who "killed" his father and took his weapon, and didn't have a Jedi Order to report back to. Plus, there's the fact that Sidious has seen this saber, and doubtless knows its provenance, so when he made the possession of a saber illegal, he would have known that this saber still existed among the Mando's, and specifically had the Empire hunting for it.

(post moar research) WOW! These idiots can't keep a story straight. No wonder they support those who want to rewrite history. THE Sacking of Coruscant officially {Legends only} refers to the that epic scene depicted in SWTOR when Malgus comes acallin'. BUT the official history of Tarre Vizsla {"canon" only} says that the DS was created 1050BBY.

I have no qualms with Logos and Shae (hot) going after the same relic. Keep the history safe, because Logos' path is going to deviate from that goal drastically. Nice to know I can still use it.

[Darth Tepes]

. My question is did Tarre have actual descendants? And then the seemingly moronic history of the saber goes further down into the muck when you think the Jedi aren't just going to hand over a saber to his surviving family because....

Well he did leave the Order to Lead Mandalore, wouldn't be hard to say he married and had children.  As far as why the Saber was at the Temple 2 possibilities enter my mind:

Tarre was like "Here...Keep it."  As a FU to the Jedi.

He was defeated by a Jedi (or two since Jedi like to tag team people except for Luke and Anakin) and it was taken as a Spoil.

[Darth Logos]

Well he did leave the Order to Lead Mandalore, wouldn't be hard to say he married and had children.  As far as why the Saber was at the Temple 2 possibilities enter my mind:

Tarre was like "Here...Keep it."  As a FU to the Jedi.

He was defeated by a Jedi (or two since Jedi like to tag team people except for Luke and Anakin) and it was taken as a Spoil.

A little surprised that you didn't go for the more obvious: like they did with Ahsoka, the Jedi made him surrender his saber when he left the Order.

It still doesn't correct the atrocious record keeping. Was he around pre or post Sacking of Coruscant? Either way, I'm sticking with the DS existing prior to the event. Basically I wanted Logos to be drawn to a McGuffin in the Jedi Temple, that he is eventually diverted from seeking. And since Logos is driven by acquiring the ultimate power (knowledge) he seeks to unlock the secrets of the DS, in the hopes of creating a more powerful saber.

[Darth Tepes]

A little surprised that you didn't go for the more obvious: like they did with Ahsoka, the Jedi made him surrender his saber when he left the Order.

I doubt a Mando Jedi would give his weapon so easy.   But this just goes more to show how Disney doesn't focus on the stuff they should.  A Mandalorian jedi from The Old Republic is ripe for stories.