Sith or Jedi story

[Kitra]

A quote from Canon? Simple!

"Jedi business, go back to your drinks" Anakin to a bar full of onlookers, who turn away on command! This also underlines the Jedi's feeling of having a "right" to act with impunity, whenever it suits them....and nobody questions it!

Didnt you already brought that up in another thread?
I can remember i just answered something very similar to that.
Well then.

 First i saw no one more in fear in that bar than anyone in cantina where han shot greedo.

 Second you are talking about the choosen one who later turns sith. He broke all rules over and over again and the council only allowed that at the word of yoda who saw the choosen one in him to in his later years acknowledging his high talent.

 Third they were hunting a criminal who nearly assassinated a noble. Amidala. And still they only capture her after trying to assassinate both jedi as well.

Any other incident?
Jedis were not feared to the slightest compared to the atrocities the sith did go on and compare.

This is jedi Business against genocide mass murder assassination uff now my english is leaving me but in german i could go on! ^^

[BenPass]

Please follow me as I spin you two different tales. Keep in mind that they are meant (especially the second one) as a hyperbole.

Little Johnny, a boy whose mother died earlier on that year, goes to the market with his father, where Little Johnny sees a brand new toy that he desperately wants. Little Johnny tugs at his father's pants leg, "Daddy, can I have that toy?"

Little Johnny's father answers, "I'm sorry Johnny, but we can't afford it today."

Little Johnny stamps his foot and whines, "Why not?"

His father looks sad and replies, "We have too many bills this week. I know it's disappointing, but we can't today. You'll understand when you're older."

Despite his disappointment, Little Johnny leaves without the toy, and years later, realizes that the toy didn't matter in the long run and that his father meant it when he said that he couldn't afford it.

In this situation, Little Johnny learns to prioritize his finances and learns to be responsible.


Now, lets look at the other story.

Little Johnny, a boy whose mother died earlier on that year, goes to the market with his father, where Little Johnny sees a brand new toy that he desperately wants. Little Johnny tugs at his father's pants leg, "Daddy, can I have that toy?"

Little Johnny's father answers, "Of course Johnny, take the toy."

When the two reach the exit doors, an employee of the market says, "Hey wait, you can't leave without paying for all that!"

Little Johnny's father pulls a handgun from his jacket, shoots the employee in the head, and drags his son over the man's lifeless body.

In this situation, Little Johnny learns that he is the only one who matters and that everyone else should simply give him what he wants.


Which would you say is good, and which would you say is evil? Yes, Johnny had a hard time without his mother, and yes, he wanted the toy. Which was the correct way for his father to act?

I am of the opinion that, generally speaking, most people who choose to align themselves with the Jedi are those who have reached the point where they "understand" because they're "older".

That is not a jab at anyone's maturity, and it is not meant to say that all Sith lovers are children...I'm simply saying that it seems, to me, that the Jedi seem to be those who are more rooted and calm.

I picture the ideal Jedi as the someone who is a nameless, unseen, servant.

I picture the ideal Sith as a tyrant.

Picture the literary versions of Richard the Lionhearted and Prince John...one good, who is a hero of the people and cares for them...one selfish, evil, and a pretender.

Those brothers, in book form, strike me as a good example of Jedi and Sith ideals.

And then you've got Robin Hood as what I would deem an Aberrant Jedi...but that's a different topic entirely.

[RogueLeader]

On the child thing, sure, you can take a disadvantaged baby and make the case easily that they would be "better off" within the order. But how would you convince a Senator from Naboo, Coruscant or Alderaan that it was in THEIR child's "best interest"? They have a silver spoon in their mouths and every advantage they could ever need already? Yet the Jedi's ranks swell from all strata of the Galaxy's social life.

Also, put yourself in the parent's position, are you REALLY going to give up your child to a perfect stranger just because he claims that your child is "gifted"? Are you really going to give your child up into a life of unquestioning servitude and NEVER see it again, just on the say-so of some "salesman" for a religious sect? Only reason I can think so many in the Galaxy do that on Star Wars is because they fear the Jedi, and see they have no option.

One final point, on the difference between Jedi and Sith; the path of the Sith is chosen, the path of the Jedi is chosen FOR THEM! (Like some kind of crazy, arranged marriage!)

QFT

Also on the child thing, has anyone ever heard of Reactive Attachment Disorder? It forms when children fail to develop strong bonds with a parent or other caregiver and, if untreated, can lead to sociopathic tendencies, rage issues, and behavioral disorders. Hitler, Stalin, and Saddam Hussein are all examples of people who had RAD but did not receive help in time.

I heard somewhere that the Jedi switch out the youngling's caregivers to ensure they don't get attached.

And people wonder why so many Jedi fall to the dark side. It's because the Jedi set them up that way.

[Darth_Arkanus]

Well I've tried the Understanding when older" approach and it's got me nowhere; while those around me have lied and cheated their way to everything. Perhaps it's time i started climbing over lifeless corpses.

I'm fed up with doing the "right thing" for everyone bar myself.

[Aurentis]

Correct, it wasn't any of their business, but Anakin's arrogant presumption to TELL them that, and expect obedience was beyond belief, and Obi-wan didn't correct him about it; and oh, how we KNOW Obi-wan loved correcting Anakin.

Quotes

"We will not go through this exercise again!"

"You will learn your place young one!"

"You will pay attention to my lead!"

OK, he's dealing with an unruly and dangerous child, but still....overkill? Much?

No.  Not overkill at all.

I will say this again, as I said it before.  Anakin's behavior in AOTC is NOT INDICATIVE OF HOW JEDI THINK OR ACT.  It is how ANAKIN thinks he has the right to act because he's the Chosen One.  He is extremely arrogant, self-righteous and an absolute slave to his emotions.  Notice Obi-Wan said absolutely nothing as he carried Zam Wessel out of the bar; there was nothing that needed to be said.  The lightsaber came out, and the severed hand holding a gun was clearly visible on the floor behind where he was standing.  People are smart enough to figure it out.  Anakin's line is one of many examples of him stepping WAY out of line.

Further, the lines you quote were not said in anger, they were said in a corrective tone used by a teacher to a student, and that is exactly what Anakin is in AOTC -- a student that is overstepping his bounds and making wild assumptions about what he can and cannot do.  My whole family is in the education field.  Trust me when I say it's especially easy to recognize the "teacher voice" coming out of people.

[Nhylus]

I want to point out, AGAIN. The Jedi are not emotionless, they are wise and mature enough to accept the things that happen to them, and to know that they are only in control of how they themselves react. The Jedi do not fall because of not having parents. Jedi fall when they become afraid, when they let their emotions take complete control over their actions. They feel too much with their heart and act without thinking.

Jedi HAVE emotions.

Jedi FEEL Happiness, Anger, Disappointment, Sadness, Sympathy, Empathy, Frustration, Confused.

But they do not let them take CONTROL of their actions.

The Sith react almost entirely on their emotions and their wants.
The Sith let their emotions completely dominate their attitude, behavior, and life.
They may be free from "strict" (And I use that loosely) rules, they may say their chains are broken, but they are slaves to their emotions.
They trade chains that aren't really there, for prison cells.

An example of a real life situation in using a Jedi and Sith mindset would be a time of depression. Let's say a breakup or a death in the family.
You can learn from what happened, you can feel sad and get it all out of you, you can do your grieving, and then you can put yourself together and understand it's not the end of your life, just the end of something you were used to. You can use your judgement and intelligence as a sentient being, to move on from it in time.
Or, you can refuse to let go, you can let your emotions run rampant and completely envelop you, completely shroud you in misery and anger, destroy your life and will to do anything day by day. You can feed your emotions and your WANT instead of doing what you MUST.

Jedi have discipline. They do what they must, over what they want.
They are not cold, and they are not thoughtless.
They just have a very strong understanding of life.

[Darth_Arkanus]

An example of a real life situation in using a Jedi and Sith mindset would be a time of depression. Let's say a breakup or a death in the family.
You can learn from what happened, you can feel sad and get it all out of you, you can do your grieving, and then you can put yourself together and understand it's not the end of your life, just the end of something you were used to. You can use your judgement and intelligence as a sentient being, to move on from it in time.
Or, you can refuse to let go, you can let your emotions run rampant and completely envelop you, completely shroud you in misery and anger, destroy your life and will to do anything day by day. You can feed your emotions and your WANT instead of doing what you MUST.

Jedi have discipline. They do what they must, over what they want.
They are not cold, and they are not thoughtless.
They just have a very strong understanding of life.

Then I truly am Sith.

[Kitra]

A Sith would never admit any kind of weakness or struggle to anyone else.

Sith are overpowering masters. Tyrants fully aware that they´re power get them all they want/need.

[Kresnik]

A Sith would never admit any kind of weakness or struggle to anyone else.

Sith are overpowering masters. Tyrants fully aware that they´re power get them all they want/need.

Yep, showing weakness will get you certain death by your master ... Or apprentice as a Sith

[Nhylus]

Then I truly am Sith.

I'm sorry you feel that way. It doesn't have to be that way.

A Sith would never admit any kind of weakness or struggle to anyone else.

Sith are overpowering masters. Tyrants fully aware that they´re power get them all they want/need.

This is very true. The Sith bottle everything up inside them. They become unstable. Which is a flipside to what most people believe about the Jedi. From a first glance, Jedi may seem to "bottle" everything up, but they simply come to terms with it.

[Darth_Arkanus]

Believe me, I did bottle things up....for years. It's only recently that I've started letting my feelings out. Anyway, I feel like I've totally hijacked the thread, and I'm sorry for that.

[RogueLeader]

I want to point out, AGAIN. The Jedi are not emotionless, they are wise and mature enough to accept the things that happen to them, and to know that they are only in control of how they themselves react. The Jedi do not fall because of not having parents. Jedi fall when they become afraid, when they let their emotions take complete control over their actions. They feel too much with their heart and act without thinking.

Jedi HAVE emotions.

Jedi FEEL Happiness, Anger, Disappointment, Sadness, Sympathy, Empathy, Frustration, Confused.

But they're not supposed too.

[kewlkev360]

But they're not supposed too.

That's not really true, they aren't supposed to let personal feelings and emotions get in the way of doing their jobs and clouding their judgements.

[Nhylus]

That's not really true, they aren't supposed to let personal feelings and emotions get in the way of doing their jobs and clouding their judgements.

Exactly. I even emphasized on this right after stating that they feel emotions.

They're Jedi, not Vulcans.

[chicago.jedi]

I did not chime in earlier because this seems like a thread we have all been down before. And the result is the same as before. The original question was simply looking for why each of us chooses one path or the other.  I will never understand why we cannot just say our reasons for choosing a path without giving reasons why the other path is wrong. I understand the need to explain why the other path does not appeal, but to argue that it is the wrong way to live does not make sense.

We all have our reasons for liking or disliking certain characters, groups, etc. And we have a right to our opinions. But so does the other guy.

Our alignment is a deeply personal thing that draws from our own beliefs and experiences and no one can say it is right or wrong. We may disagree and we have the right to that as well. But the mudslinging that goes on with the threads like this one blows my mind. What is there to gain?

We can argue Jedi and Sith until we are blue in the face. There is no right answer. There is no wrong answer. And most importantly, there is no prize at the end. Nobody is going to “win.” We will just irritate each other and loose friends, and for what?

I love to read members’ reasons for choosing one path or the other (no matter which one it is). It makes me sad to read the “you’re wrong for thinking that way” counter arguments.

I consider myself on the Jedi path for various reasons. But I can assure you, that none of them are to feel superior, to bother anyone, or put anyone else down. If someone wants to be on the Sith, Grey Jedi, Dark Jedi, etc. …path, that is fine with me. It is their prerogative and I am always happy to hear reasons for why that path makes them happy.