A note concerning some of the rumors flying around...

[JangoUnfettered]

Allow me to clairify.
A member posts they want a particular saber on FX.
Your PM directing them offsite to find said saber on a competitors website that does not want to be involved with FX is disrespectful to the agreement in place.
You are advertising for a competitor as word of mouth.
For all you know a FX member has one or is getting one ready to sell and intended to contact them.

Again standing in a store and handing out flyers to a competitor's store however slyly is still wrong.

[directorcass]

Example #2

Someone hears about cool lightsabers or sees them in a store. They google the name Hasbro FX Sabers and see a website. They join and want to know all about lightsabers and where they can get one. They want an Obi TPM. They find out that Hasbro doesn't make it. They find out that the dealers on the forum don't make them anymore. Someone sends them a PM saying well, there is this one that is inspired by the one you want and is currently available.

In your scenario, I should just sit around and wait to see if anyone wants to sell me something?

The forum and Mods wont allow it, but this nonsense could go back and forth all day.

Moving on now......

[Ultra]

Jango, as a staff member of FX, would you similarly discourage FX members, like General Veers,  from PMing the members here to bash my company and promote FX Sabers?  That has been happening here for quite some time. It would be nice if that behavior would stop.

[JangoUnfettered]

Perhaps it was a dire need.

I'll craft an announcement and post it in the website news and announcement area.

[Ultra]

Dire need?

[JangoUnfettered]

In reply 273
If you feel there is a dire need to communicate to an FX Saber member about something Ultrasabers then doing it via PM works just fine.  Just like I'm sure the FX sabers community communicates with our members via PM as we've heard about on many occasions.

Your announcement request has been posted.

[Ultra]

Thanks for taking the high road.

To clarify, if someone asks a question about Ultrasabers or FX, I dont think its out of line to pm that member. However, if Michael Murphy wants this to stop, all he has to do is ask.

What certain well known FX members were doing were PMing random members here on a defamation campaign and using their FX credentials to bolster their credibility.  That type of behavior cannot be justified and casts FX in a bad light.

Regardless of anyone's position in any of these debates, those tactics should be discouraged by all sides.

I openly oppose any member of Saber Forum using other forums to attack another company.
Saber fans tend to be very loyal to their builder of choice. That loyalty can be manipulated to turn customers into weapons by sicking them on your competition. It is an obscene abuse of trust to use your customers like that.

I will always encourage our fans to support us in a positive way and will never use them as pawns in a business war.

I only wish everyone in this hobby would do the same.

[Master Bluespike74]

In support of Ultra, I have placed all of my comments here on this forum.  My online name is bluespike74 and bluespike1974.  I go by nothing else and I have gone by nothing else since 11/19/2001. 

Ultra has never asked me to attack anyone or encouraged any comment that I have posted. 

It has been my personal observation that the more anyone (regardless of forum or media used and regardless of where their loyalties lie) takes to the net to bash Ultrasabers, the more that I have seen people come here to ask questions.  Often times this leads to people buying products, sometimes it doesn't.  That is just how the cookie crumbles. 

The funny thing about life is that truth often rears its head no matter the time or situation. 

People are offering olive branches and seeking peaceful resolutions, I respect that.

People have the individual choices they have to make, I respect that.

In the end, respect for ourselves guides our morals.  Respect for others guides our manners. 

Everyone regardless their feelings or position should read and take to heart Ultra's post about how we should be discouraging attacks on others and that we should be working hard to support our builders of choice.  These two things can be achieved simultaneously.  You can build your own house and not destroy your neighbor's house to do it. 

My hat off to Ultra for stating this so well and calmly.

Blue

[Vrakul]

In the end, respect for ourselves guides our morals.  Respect for others guides our manners.

Well said! 

[JangoUnfettered]

Example #2

Someone hears about cool lightsabers or sees them in a store. They google the name Hasbro FX Sabers and see a website. They join and want to know all about lightsabers and where they can get one. They want an Obi TPM. They find out that Hasbro doesn't make it. They find out that the dealers on the forum don't make them anymore. Someone sends them a PM saying well, there is this one that is inspired by the one you want and is currently available.

In your scenario, I should just sit around and wait to see if anyone wants to sell me something?

The forum and Mods wont allow it, but this nonsense could go back and forth all day.

Moving on now......

To counter your example there are posts on here asking for Imperial Knight sabers.
I assume Ultra and Deep have seen these and could be working on these to bring them into the ultrasabers store again. I owned an original and it was fun to modify and use.

I know of one store and a member that sells IK's and or is getting ready to list one for sale soon
Would it be okay for me to PM those members and tell them the stores and members name and they will be available soon?
Clearly not. It would take sales away from US to do so.
There is a rule against advertising competitor shops on this forum. The Selling notices is similar.

All I'm asking is that the agreement be respected on FX. I do not want to have to put a rule to deal with this in place on FX. If it is going to be an issue, I can see about making it so.

If there is a specific question about an Ultrasabers product, please direct them here. I do this often.

[DarthFluffyKitten]

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dx0Shn5Hvpc" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dx0Shn5Hvpc</a>

[Ultra]

If FX Sabers has a policy about what can and can't be discussed in private messages, then I guess people will have to abide by it if they want to use that forum.

Jango, is it safe to assume, by your posts here, that you are authorized to speak on behalf of FX Sabers?

[Taun Telon]

Allow me to clairify.
A member posts they want a particular saber on FX.
Your PM directing them offsite to find said saber on a competitors website that does not want to be involved with FX is disrespectful to the agreement in place.
You are advertising for a competitor as word of mouth.
For all you know a FX member has one or is getting one ready to sell and intended to contact them.

Again standing in a store and handing out flyers to a competitor's store however slyly is still wrong.

I was under the impression that the PMs would be to people who were new, or were asking about "what sabers are out there" type questions.  NOT "Im going to buy this one" type posts.

You have to admit, if someone posted a response IN A THREAD, "hey theres US and they are good for what youre looking for" they would be flamed off this earth, after they were told "we don't talk about US here".  Those specific situations would be when a CUSTOMER (not "advertiser") of US would PM them and mention that, hey, there is this other type of saber company that you could look at.

How is that disrespecting competition? Especially since it is PM, especially since it is not aimed to discredit anyone, and especially since it is on a board where there are plenty of "other" competing sellers present?  


I'm JUST trying to understand and make sure we are on the same page.  No one here was ever suggesting that we "take up a cause" and get US "back on the FX forums" via PM.  We're not trying to undermine anyone, just avoid open thread talk while offering help to people who may not know all their options... NOT trying to upsell or downsell anyone.

[Taun Telon]

Official rules now on FX:

"ultrasabers has reported that members here have been using the PM system on saberforum to bash his company and promote other company products.

If you are doing so, Stop doing it.

Unless there is a DIRE need or you are asked a specific question directly."


"On the same note, those of you who are using the PM system here to talk about Ultrasabers products, stop it.  I know that Alex approves of this but he can't have it both ways.  He is the one who requested we stop talking about him, so we should stop talking about him.

If there is any confusion or questions regarding either of these two posts, please feel free to contact a staff member."

[Ultra]

I have a hard time believing Michael Murphy actually approved any of that. 

 This thread is not about discussing the private message policies of other forums. Let's just move on from that subject.