Form IV: Ataru

[Master Nero Attoru]

Which brings me to a point that I have been thinking of for a while but never voiced.

Game Mechanics... Be careful of how you view lightsaber combat with respect to game mechanics... Starkiller is referred to as using Shien, so everyone just assumes that Shien is exclusively reverse grip.... While Shien is of predisposition for reverse grip, it is not doctrine. Simply game mechanics... the reason Starkiller uses reverse grip is because the developers wanted to focus on Starkiller being a wrecking ball of the Force, so not your usual Jedi hack and slash lightsaber game... They wanted to focus on making the Force an offensive tank of a weapon.

Same with SWTOR.... The forms they depict are rather one dimensional, and usually just a "placeholder name" for the buffs and bonuses they want to implement.

Not saying at all that you are wrong, or not to pull from games, because we learn a great deal of knowledge from the EU side of Star Wars. I'm merely cautioning everyone that pigeonholing a particular form because of game mechanics can make you lose sight of the rest of the form.

Same as basing an entire form off of one Sequence... the form is made up of many sequences and velocities... (at least that's the way I'm developing them) So there is room for many interpretations and multiple techniques that build off of each other, and yes, even techniques that overlap between forms. 

Very true.  IMO the Forms are a totally separate entity to the different weapon styles (saberstaff, dual wielding, etc).  You can mix and match them at will.

Of course, canonically there is some more overlap with Ataru and Jar'kai - perhaps this is because of Ataru's focus on overwhelming an opponent (an additional blade would obviously assist in this regard).  In the case of SWTOR, Ataru and Juyo are paired with dual wielding because they're aggressive forms, which matches up with the Sentinel (damage dealing) class.  Conversely, the Guardian class offers Shien and Soresu for its DPS and tanking routes respectively.

[Master Uilos]

Which is all funny, considering that Jar'kai is a part of Niman, which has it's roots in Soresu.

[Master Nero Attoru]

Which is all funny, considering that Jar'kai is a part of Niman, which has it's roots in Soresu.

That is funny, isn't it?  When you look at the (albeit fictional) history of these forms, it's interesting how they jump from one theme to the next.  I mean Djem So also sprung out of Soresu, and that's another incredibly aggressive style!

[ZequarX]

This just brings us back to your soup analogy, Nero

It's just adding in the other ingredients and dinner is served, voila!

[Master Lucien Kane]

Some of my sparring partners weren't able to show up today, so it was just me and one other guy... So I decided to start my Ataru training regimen... Which consisted of me going unarmed and having my friend try to obliterate me... He had foam on his blade before anyone goes  trying to say we weren't being safe... Anyways... At first I was getting nabbed left and right... but then I started moving much better... then I grabbed a saber, and... WOW... I was untouchable! It was insane.

[ZequarX]

Some of my sparring partners weren't able to show up today, so it was just me and one other guy... So I decided to start my Ataru training regimen... Which consisted of me going unarmed and having my friend try to obliterate me... He had foam on his blade before anyone goes  trying to say we weren't being safe... Anyways... At first I was getting nabbed left and right... but then I started moving much better... then I grabbed a saber, and... WOW... I was untouchable! It was insane.

That's actually a really nice way of getting better at dodging and evading incoming attacks! Kudo's for you LK. I will try that next time my brother is over..with foam padding of course. I was messing around with my spins and flourishes over the weekend and hit myself right on top of my ankle bone...yea it hurt like crap, so foam sounds like a GREAT idea!

[Master Lucien Kane]

Thanks! It's the painfully stupid way to learn, but seems to be the only way I learn. The more I get smacked in the face, the less I like it, the more I want to not get hit in the face again. So... I think with a few more months of practicing, and hopefully a few months of gymnastics training, I'll have them moves like Zallow. I'll have them moves like Zallow. I'll have them moooooooooves like Zallow.

[ZequarX]

@LK

Nice on the Maroon 5 reference lol. One thing that will help with your gymastic's, LK, is practicing your handstands. I know it sounds weird, but holding a handstand requires massive core and upper body work and going back to my parkour roots, the handstand is considered one of the most important move in a traceur's aresenal. Practicing the HS must be consistent in order to make progress. I recommend practicing the HS for a few minutes every day

Also good for gymastics and building up explosive power: The pistol squat

I'm am full of fitness info if you ever need any advice or have any questions!

[Master Uilos]

I'll have them moves like Zallow. I'll have them moves like Zallow. I'll have them moooooooooves like Zallow.

You, sir, get a point

[Master Lucien Kane]

You, sir, get a point

Thanks! I now feel the need to do a music video titled "Moves like Zallow" lol.

[Veldryne]

DO IT

[Darth Nonymous]

Back on the topic of Ataru: What I found most interesting is the concept of "Su Ma" in Yoda's style. These three movements, while corresponding to three demential axis, also corresponds to the three planes of movement in the body.

Sagital plane: ton su ma
Frontal plane: en su ma
Transverse: jung su ma

Not only does it relate to the acrobatics, bit also the stabilization patterns in the body while doing work (in this case fighting with a weapon). While the acrobatics will be obvious, the power created by those stability patterns will not. I think that's as good an apology for the differences between Yoda's Ataru and Qui Gong jinn's performance.

One being the obvious manifestation, Yoda's small size would have a far greater global effect on his body being able to send it flying and turing with out the ground to help him. Forget the force assist for a second, conventional physics would suggest this would be the effect and a very good way to maximize the advantages of small size with as true full body power behind it (like falling on your keys).

The other being the more subtle yet still devastating manifestation of a large humanoid who instead of housing that power into leaving the ground himself, but rather into each swing of the saber (like thinking there is one more step at the bottom of the staircase ) and the ability to essentially rebound the force of the clash back to the opponent.

[ZequarX]

Back on the topic of Ataru: What I found most interesting is the concept of "Su Ma" in Yoda's style. These three movements, while corresponding to three demential axis, also corresponds to the three planes of movement in the body.

Sagital plane: ton su ma
Frontal plane: en su ma
Transverse: jung su ma

Not only does it relate to the acrobatics, bit also the stabilization patterns in the body while doing work (in this case fighting with a weapon). While the acrobatics will be obvious, the power created by those stability patterns will not. I think that's as good an apology for the differences between Yoda's Ataru and Qui Gong jinn's performance.

One being the obvious manifestation, Yoda's small size would have a far greater global effect on his body being able to send it flying and turing with out the ground to help him. Forget the force assist for a second, conventional physics would suggest this would be the effect and a very good way to maximize the advantages of small size with as true full body power behind it (like falling on your keys).

The other being the more subtle yet still devastating manifestation of a large humanoid who instead of housing that power into leaving the ground himself, but rather into each swing of the saber (like thinking there is one more step at the bottom of the staircase ) and the ability to essentially rebound the force of the clash back to the opponent.

Excellent post and breakdown! Point for you sir! I really like where this is going and look forward to more on this Darth Nonymous

[Veldryne]

Agreed, very nice breakdown, well said. And more for people to think about when working on ataru based combat.

[Master Uilos]

Back on the topic of Ataru: What I found most interesting is the concept of "Su Ma" in Yoda's style. These three movements, while corresponding to three demential axis, also corresponds to the three planes of movement in the body.

Sagital plane: ton su ma
Frontal plane: en su ma
Transverse: jung su ma

Not only does it relate to the acrobatics, bit also the stabilization patterns in the body while doing work (in this case fighting with a weapon). While the acrobatics will be obvious, the power created by those stability patterns will not. I think that's as good an apology for the differences between Yoda's Ataru and Qui Gong jinn's performance.

One being the obvious manifestation, Yoda's small size would have a far greater global effect on his body being able to send it flying and turing with out the ground to help him. Forget the force assist for a second, conventional physics would suggest this would be the effect and a very good way to maximize the advantages of small size with as true full body power behind it (like falling on your keys).

The other being the more subtle yet still devastating manifestation of a large humanoid who instead of housing that power into leaving the ground himself, but rather into each swing of the saber (like thinking there is one more step at the bottom of the staircase ) and the ability to essentially rebound the force of the clash back to the opponent.

Nonymous, anyways you're from PA?

either way, beautiful break down. And you've essentially differentiated between the Yoda-Ataru and the Qui-Gon Ataru.