Rogue One: A Star Wars Story - Spoilers and Discussion Thread.

[JediJacob]

Did anyone else notice the OTHER new TIE variant?  The one that looked very much like the TIE/striker, but had a flatter, wedge shaped front end and the two "wings" attached at the rear end by more solar panel material?

Please tell me I didn't imagine seeing a few of those at various points on Scarif.

There were TIE strikers yeah...The battlefront game EA had they dropped their rogue one DLC last week and it confirmed that those were TIE strikers.

[Jev Moldara]

Yeah it was supposed to be a nod to him...though people thought they were actually going to have starkiller in it before release.That was done on purpose... the original trilogy used models and they wanted to make it feel like the original trilogy were they could instead of doing CGI for them. Its the same reason when they switch to inside a X or Y wing it's an old film grain look. I actually liked it.

Well, I think the film grain look was more for continuity's sake than nostalgia. After all, there's only so far you can digitally enhance a film reel before it starts looking like crap, so instead of sacrificing the integrity of the film reel and making Red and Gold Leader's look bad on the screen, they decided to clean up the film reel footage the best they could and then "degrade" the other in-cockpit stuff to match it up to the film reel footage in terms of quality. Basically, they found a happy medium between updating the old and preserving it without redoing the actors in CGI.

[Darth Logos]

Wouldn't the Hammerhead maneuver work the same way a tugboat pulls a massive ocean liner (minus gravity, and friction)?

I think the gross difference in mass would be like a toddler trying to move a sumo.

Yeah it was supposed to be a nod to him...though people thought they were actually going to have starkiller in it before release.

I would have seriously lost my shell (as well as various other bodily functions) if they had resurrected the character.

That was done on purpose... the original trilogy used models and they wanted to make it feel like the original trilogy were they could instead of doing CGI for them. Its the same reason when they switch to inside a X or Y wing it's an old film grain look. I actually liked it.

I didn't mind the model-esque look. It was the unpainted look that bugged me. OT SDs were metal grey, not white.

On the note of the ships..they just following the shuttle designs from the imperial shuttle and adding to it and with the DS...In new hope they say hit the main reactor that will set off a chain reaction just like they do in rogue. No they never say there's more than one but with a station that big it would make sense that there was.

"Single reactor ignition..."

Did anyone else notice the OTHER new TIE variant?  The one that looked very much like the TIE/striker, but had a flatter, wedge shaped front end and the two "wings" attached at the rear end by more solar panel material?

Please tell me I didn't imagine seeing a few of those at various points on Scarif.

Nope. I didn't want to criticize, as they might have been conceived as more stable low altitude "strike" craft. So I let them slide.

[JediJacob]

I think the gross difference in mass would be like a toddler trying to move a sumo.
I would have seriously lost my shell (as well as various other bodily functions) if they had resurrected the character.
I didn't mind the model-esque look. It was the unpainted look that bugged me. OT SDs were metal grey, not white.
"Single reactor ignition..."
Nope. I didn't want to criticize, as they might have been conceived as more stable low altitude "strike" craft. So I let them slide.

With the hammerhead i wanna remind you that the destroyer it moved...was already disabled and going down slowly...the hamerhead merely pushed and directed it with its thrusters into another one. In space where  the slightest touch can cause something to move its very possible.

the single reactor ignition they said proves there more than one... Instead of fully blowing up the planet they said "target the city with single reactor ignition" and "fire when ready single reactor ignition"... it's why the laser didn't blow up the entire planet it only used one reactor. If there was only a single reactor it wouldn't make sense to make that specific command as EVERY ignition would be only single reactor. They never said there was only one reactor.

[ithekro]

There was the TIE Striker, but also what looked to be a troop transport variant of the TIE Striker that the Death Troopers came into battle on near the end.

Someone said they saw a TIE Defender in the space battle.  Patterned after the design from Rebels.


The Hammerhead acted as a large set of maneuvering thrusters for the Star Destroyer.   It has been suggested these are the same ships supplied by Alderaan for Phoenix Group last year in Rebels, but had been modified in the three years they have been in Rebel service.  It would also give more reason for General Syndulla to be present at the battle in the Ghost if some of her ships are present in the fight.   I did not see any A-wings, not was their Quazar Fire=class carrier present.  I figure either she didn't have her whole force near Yavin, or they lose the carrier against Thrawn as some point later this season of Rebels.  The Phantom is also not present, meaning they lose it (again) or it is on a mission (likely Ezra and Kanan off someplace else, assuming they aren't dead yet, as the Alliance despertately wants to pick up Obi-wan at this point because they need a Jedi to rally behind).   

[Landen Se-Sentien]

I agree that the hammerhead corvette was plausible. In the Navy, a corvette is a pretty generic term for a small bit very fast boat. A small but very fast shipping could easily build up enough momentum and inertia to make a massive object change course when resistance isn't a factor. Don't believe me? Apollo 13. When it went dead and was relying in gravity to maintain its course, they had to bag their urine, because expelling it would have altered the course of the ship.

Also, how do we know there weren't separate reactors that powered the DS and it's weapons? The laser, in theory, could have several reactors used to power it, while the main reactor powered everything else. That main reactor is what got blown up. Of course, I have no real knowledge of the DS schematics and designs, so I'm just throwing that out as an idea with no real evidence to back it up.

[Darth Logos]

With the hammerhead i wanna remind you that the destroyer it moved...was already disabled and going down slowly...the hamerhead merely pushed and directed it with its thrusters into another one. In space where  the slightest touch can cause something to move its very possible.

I can't find any images to illustrate the difference in size, but trust me...it wouldn't happen. Now one of those larger capital ships, definitely. Even though smaller, not as small as a corvette.

the single reactor ignition they said proves there more than one... Instead of fully blowing up the planet they said "target the city with single reactor ignition" and "fire when ready single reactor ignition"... it's why the laser didn't blow up the entire planet it only used one reactor. If there was only a single reactor it wouldn't make sense to make that specific command as EVERY ignition would be only single reactor. They never said there was only one reactor.

Duh. I was always under the impression that ALL power was derived from the Main. Oh well, I did like that they had given it a "dimmer switch."

Someone said they saw a TIE Defender in the space battle.  Patterned after the design from Rebels.

The TIE/D is not from Rebels. It was from way back. Unless they have tweaked the design for SWR.

I agree that the hammerhead corvette was plausible. In the Navy, a corvette is a pretty generic term for a small bit very fast boat. A small but very fast shipping could easily build up enough momentum and inertia to make a massive object change course when resistance isn't a factor. Don't believe me? Apollo 13. When it went dead and was relying in gravity to maintain its course, they had to bag their urine, because expelling it would have altered the course of the ship.

Ok then movie physicist....Armageddon. Jason Isaacs' character said you could throw 100 nukes at the asteroid, and it would still keep coming. The hammerhead would most like have bounced off the SD. Going off that the prow bit into the structure of the SD, yes its engines all-ahead full could eventually start to move the SD, but it would not have happened that fast.

But moot point, the results were spectacular. Suck it, Bay. That's how you blow shell up.

[ithekro]

The TIE/D is not from Rebels. It was from way back. Unless they have tweaked the design for SWR.

They tweaked it slightly for Rebels I think.

[Jev Moldara]

Ok then movie physicist....Armageddon. Jason Isaacs' character said you could throw 100 nukes at the asteroid, and it would still keep coming. The hammerhead would most like have bounced off the SD. Going off that the prow bit into the structure of the SD, yes its engines all-ahead full could eventually start to move the SD, but it would not have happened that fast.

Easily explained. The asteroid, aside from being the size of Texas, was already in motion at an incredible rate of speed.

The ISD, on the other hand, was pretty much stationary and, thanks to the ion shots, wasn't going anywhere.

It's Newton's first law of motion: An object at rest stays at rest and an object in motion stays in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force.

This is why lobbing a hundred nukes at the asteroid wouldn't work. It might slow it down a bit, but it won't destroy it. That's why they were on such a timetable to drill the holes and detonate the nuke. They had to split it in two so the two halves would separate enough to pass the Earth without colliding. They couldn't blow it up even with every nuclear weapon ever made three times over, so they had to strategically get around the problem, or in this case, make the problem go around them.

In Rogue One, the ISD is pretty much stationary when the Hammerhead strikes it. That alone would have been enough to destabilize its position, but then they kept pushing. Think of it like being in a swimming pool. You're laying down, floating, and pretty much still. Someone nudges you, and what happens? You move... just a bit, but you move, and you keep moving. That's a small version of a single unbalanced force acting upon a stationary object. Now, same scenario, but this time someone is pushing you and giving it everything they have. You will move faster and further than with a single push.

[Landen Se-Sentien]

Ok then movie physicist....Armageddon. Jason Isaacs' character said you could throw 100 nukes at the asteroid, and it would still keep coming. The hammerhead would most like have bounced off the SD. Going off that the prow bit into the structure of the SD, yes its engines all-ahead full could eventually start to move the SD, but it would not have happened that fast.

But moot point, the results were spectacular. Suck it, Bay. That's how you blow shell up.

Not movie physics. Real physics. I read Jim Lovell's book Lost Moon, before it got renamed Apollo 13 because of the movie, and he went into detail that they did exactly what we saw in the movie for that exact reason.

Like Jev said, in Armageddon, they were out of time, not that they couldn't change its course. They wouldn't be able to change it enough. The idea of moving an asteroid instead of blowing it up is the prevailing thought amongst scientists about how to deal with it. The trick is detecting it and reaching it on enough time.

I'll agree, with you, though, that it likely would have taken longer, and that it was spectacular.  

If there's one thing we could definitely gripe about when it comes to how they depict space flight, it's the fighters. Without thrusters covering their bodies, they wouldn't fly anything like that due to a lack of air resistance, but I digress.

I'm really glad you liked it. I did, too. BTW, did you notice what he did to that guy he Force pinned on the ceiling?

[JediJacob]

I'm really glad you liked it. I did, too. BTW, did you notice what he did to that guy he Force pinned on the ceiling?

Didn't he reflect a blaster shot into him?

[Darth Logos]

Easily explained. The asteroid, aside from being the size of Texas, was already in motion at an incredible rate of speed.

The ISD, on the other hand, was pretty much stationary and, thanks to the ion shots, wasn't going anywhere.

It's Newton's first law of motion: An object at rest stays at rest and an object in motion stays in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force.

This is why lobbing a hundred nukes at the asteroid wouldn't work. It might slow it down a bit, but it won't destroy it. That's why they were on such a timetable to drill the holes and detonate the nuke. They had to split it in two so the two halves would separate enough to pass the Earth without colliding. They couldn't blow it up even with every nuclear weapon ever made three times over, so they had to strategically get around the problem, or in this case, make the problem go around them.

In Rogue One, the ISD is pretty much stationary when the Hammerhead strikes it. That alone would have been enough to destabilize its position, but then they kept pushing. Think of it like being in a swimming pool. You're laying down, floating, and pretty much still. Someone nudges you, and what happens? You move... just a bit, but you move, and you keep moving. That's a small version of a single unbalanced force acting upon a stationary object. Now, same scenario, but this time someone is pushing you and giving it everything they have. You will move faster and further than with a single push.

Key word "unbalanced" as in F_acting > F_resisting. Basically, the moving momentum (mass x velocity) of the hammerhead had to be grater than the standing momentum of the SD, in which case the velocity is that of the moving hammerhead. Ergo, since M_SD > M_HH the momentum of the HH is insufficient to move the SD. At least not that fast.

[Jev Moldara]

Key word "unbalanced" as in F_acting > F_resisting. Basically, the moving momentum (mass x velocity) of the hammerhead had to be grater than the standing momentum of the SD, in which case the velocity is that of the moving hammerhead. Ergo, since M_SD > M_HH the momentum of the HH is insufficient to move the SD. At least not that fast.

Ah, but in space there are no other resistances to counteract, so as long as the HH can apply enough pressure to move it to begin with, the thrusters can keep applying more and more relative force to the ISD because the ISD is now in motion, and the relative forward velocity of the HH is being added to the ISD's momentum. It's like a merry go round. The first push to turn it is the hardest, but once you get it going, it takes less and less energy to move it faster.

Didn't he reflect a blaster shot into him?

From what I saw, he pretty much bisected him as an afterthought.

[JediJacob]

From what I saw, he pretty much bisected him as an afterthought.

yeah i saw the saber go back as an after thought just with all the blaster fire couldn't tell if it was a redirect or him actually cutting... either way it looked sweet.

[shade_1313]

There was the TIE Striker, but also what looked to be a troop transport variant of the TIE Striker that the Death Troopers came into battle on near the end.

 

Thank you, you're the only one who got what I was saying when I said the OTHER new TIE design.  I meant the design that had the same basic "wing" design as the TIE/sk, but with continuity of the solar panel across the aft portion and the wedge shaped forward hull.  And what you suggest, that it was the transport that the Death Troopers got out of makes a ton of sense.  I actually found myself wondering, during my second watching (had to take my son, after all) just what they'd disembarked from.  For a fast moving, small team of spec ops type troopers, a fast TIE insertion ship makes a heck of a lot of sense.  Hope we see more details on it soon (looking at you, LEGO, in particular).

Also, another thing that I really liked seeing was the Death Troopers firing from prone, nestled into a crest of the beach sand.  Nice to see them fighting like they really mean it.