Do you actually duell with Lightsaber forms?

[Kham-Ryn Kurios]

I was thinking about the NJO 'Forms' (Fast, Strong, Medium), and I was thinking that perhaps we could use these as further classification for the physical aspects of each Form rather than seperate forms? I've seen people who claim to use Ataru solely because they spin a lot, and that could be called Ataru Medium, whereas my version would be Ataru Fast. Just a thought.

I like this.

I guess I'd be Vapaad Fast or Juyo Fast; since I know that Vapaad wasn't created till later.

[Master Nero Attoru]

I was thinking about the NJO 'Forms' (Fast, Strong, Medium), and I was thinking that perhaps we could use these as further classification for the physical aspects of each Form rather than seperate forms? I've seen people who claim to use Ataru solely because they spin a lot, and that could be called Ataru Medium, whereas my version would be Ataru Fast. Just a thought.

That's a neat idea.  I would have a hard time meshing the two together personally, since the NJO "forms" are a bit oversimplified (fast and weak, medium, slow and strong), but I definitely think you have a good point about different expressions of the forms.  It's part of what I mean when I say that they're subjective - SOTJ's Ataru probably has little in common with my Ataru for instance.  She jumps a great deal, I avoid it for the most part - I tend to regard it as a waste of energy.  It's like she utilizes a Yoda type of Ataru, while I emulate the Qui-Gon version.  We each take a different part of the core of Ataru and expand upon it, and that rarely results in the same thing.

The only thing I'm not big on the NJO forms about is their tendency to regard speed and strength as the only two contributing factors.  That sort of thinking is more applicable to techniques and their application, while the traditional forms address more tactics and style IMO.

[SOTJ]

I might make a new topic for this idea later so as not to repurpose this one too much

[John-Michael]

Okay, people... Really?  Really?!

First off, let's all get in touch with REALITY here. 

Do we need to mention that the "7 Forms of Lightsaber Combat" are not REAL martial arts styles?  I mean, we all know they were written as fictional descriptions to help describe characters and the setting in the Star Wars stories -- right?  So, the emphasis here is the author's desire to tell a story, and not necessarily describe a realistic martial form.  Sure, some of them were inspired by one or more martial arts (from fencing to kendo to wing-chun) and were portrayed by combining different skill sets that include tennis and ballet.  But you couldn't use one or more of the "7 lightsaber forms" in an actual fight, could you?

Second, I think it is safe to presume that these lightsaber forms were created for use with lightsabers, which, as we all know, do not really exist.  We heft around 2-pound lightsaber props, which are very different from the nearly weightless laser swords from the Star Wars stories.  Therefore, one cannot actually use the weapon as it is intended and described.

Third, the Force is actively present and used in the Lightsaber Combat Forms, where the wielder utilizes from hyper-acrobatic leaps, precognitive sense, inhumanly fast reflexes and telekineses (among others) during lightsaber combat.  In REALITY, however -- maybe not so much.   If you think this is something you can do now, try playing tennis with your lightsaber prop.  if you can do it well enough to win the Wimbledon Championship, then perhaps you do have the ability to wield the Force adequately enough to say you can use even the simplest of the fictional 7 forms of lightsaber combat.

I'm not trying to be the wet blanket on everyone's Star Wars fantasies, but come on, people!

How about learning martial arts that actually exist on this side of reality and applying it to your saber-hefting hobby?  Wouldn't that be more fun and healthier than claiming to be able to use fictional and completely unrealistic sci-fi/fantasy "lightsaber forms?"

Again, I don't mean to offend or step on any toes here.  If I do, then I apologize in advance.

[SOTJ]

How about learning martial arts that actually exist on this side of reality and applying it to your saber-hefting hobby?  Wouldn't that be more fun and healthier than claiming to be able to use fictional and completely unrealistic sci-fi/fantasy "lightsaber forms?"

Again, I don't mean to offend or step on any toes here.  If I do, then I apologize in advance.

I don't think anybody here claims to be able to use the forms as they are shown in the movies.... the only reasons I bother with the forms are because I enjoy classifying things and it seems a logical way to classify different styles of 'combat' on here. No offense taken, but I think you should expect a lot of talk about the forms on a SW-centered forum.

[Chainmale75]

From what I've seen and read, it's more people trying to classify their sword play to that of SW lore, You duel with what your comfortable with, the check to see what it resembles. As far as actual styles..The average Samurai duel is over in what....5 sec or less ?  where's the fun in that !  lol Some styles of Swordsmanship DO have 2 person exercises, but I'ts pretty hard to find others to practice it. At least in my Xp.  Higher populated ares might have better chances.

[Kham-Ryn Kurios]

Okay, people... Really?  Really?!

First off, let's all get in touch with REALITY here. 

Do we need to mention that the "7 Forms of Lightsaber Combat" are not REAL martial arts styles?  I mean, we all know they were written as fictional descriptions to help describe characters and the setting in the Star Wars stories -- right?  So, the emphasis here is the author's desire to tell a story, and not necessarily describe a realistic martial form.  Sure, some of them were inspired by one or more martial arts (from fencing to kendo to wing-chun) and were portrayed by combining different skill sets that include tennis and ballet.  But you couldn't use one or more of the "7 lightsaber forms" in an actual fight, could you?

Second, I think it is safe to presume that these lightsaber forms were created for use with lightsabers, which, as we all know, do not really exist.  We heft around 2-pound lightsaber props, which are very different from the nearly weightless laser swords from the Star Wars stories.  Therefore, one cannot actually use the weapon as it is intended and described.

Third, the Force is actively present and used in the Lightsaber Combat Forms, where the wielder utilizes from hyper-acrobatic leaps, precognitive sense, inhumanly fast reflexes and telekineses (among others) during lightsaber combat.  In REALITY, however -- maybe not so much.   If you think this is something you can do now, try playing tennis with your lightsaber prop.  if you can do it well enough to win the Wimbledon Championship, then perhaps you do have the ability to wield the Force adequately enough to say you can use even the simplest of the fictional 7 forms of lightsaber combat.

I'm not trying to be the wet blanket on everyone's Star Wars fantasies, but come on, people!

How about learning martial arts that actually exist on this side of reality and applying it to your saber-hefting hobby?  Wouldn't that be more fun and healthier than claiming to be able to use fictional and completely unrealistic sci-fi/fantasy "lightsaber forms?"

Again, I don't mean to offend or step on any toes here.  If I do, then I apologize in advance.

Seriously, you should lighten up.

ITS FICTION.

I think you knew before you posted all of this that it provided nothing to the conversation.

Its tone was nothing but super condescending.

Now I see your point but we aren't seriously thinking we are waiting real lightsabers in our hands.

So,

Chill out and please refrain from being a wet blanket because its Star Wars, none of it is happening in Reality. If we needed that clarification, we would have bigger problems on our hands than discussing real world translations of FICTIONAL lightsaber combat.

MTFBWY and cheers.

[ThreadJack]

What Chainmale said, hits the nail on the head. We don't actually think we're using the 7 forms, we just use them as a way to describe our fighting styles using Star Wars terms.

[Master Uilos]

Okay, people... Really?  Really?!

First off, let's all get in touch with REALITY here. 

Do we need to mention that the "7 Forms of Lightsaber Combat" are not REAL martial arts styles?  I mean, we all know they were written as fictional descriptions to help describe characters and the setting in the Star Wars stories -- right?  So, the emphasis here is the author's desire to tell a story, and not necessarily describe a realistic martial form.  Sure, some of them were inspired by one or more martial arts (from fencing to kendo to wing-chun) and were portrayed by combining different skill sets that include tennis and ballet.  But you couldn't use one or more of the "7 lightsaber forms" in an actual fight, could you?

Second, I think it is safe to presume that these lightsaber forms were created for use with lightsabers, which, as we all know, do not really exist.  We heft around 2-pound lightsaber props, which are very different from the nearly weightless laser swords from the Star Wars stories.  Therefore, one cannot actually use the weapon as it is intended and described.

Third, the Force is actively present and used in the Lightsaber Combat Forms, where the wielder utilizes from hyper-acrobatic leaps, precognitive sense, inhumanly fast reflexes and telekineses (among others) during lightsaber combat.  In REALITY, however -- maybe not so much.   If you think this is something you can do now, try playing tennis with your lightsaber prop.  if you can do it well enough to win the Wimbledon Championship, then perhaps you do have the ability to wield the Force adequately enough to say you can use even the simplest of the fictional 7 forms of lightsaber combat.

I'm not trying to be the wet blanket on everyone's Star Wars fantasies, but come on, people!

How about learning martial arts that actually exist on this side of reality and applying it to your saber-hefting hobby?  Wouldn't that be more fun and healthier than claiming to be able to use fictional and completely unrealistic sci-fi/fantasy "lightsaber forms?"

Again, I don't mean to offend or step on any toes here.  If I do, then I apologize in advance.

Most of the people posting on this thread study, practice, and in some cases teach martial arts. This is hypothetical discussions, a bunch of martial geeks sitting around going "I wonder how a martial art that doesn't exist, for a weapon that doesn't exist, would work" and everyone here realizes that (I would hope so). If you took the time to read in between the lines, or the other posts we make, you would see it.

[Master Nero Attoru]

Most of the people posting on this thread study, practice, and in some cases teach martial arts. This is hypothetical discussions, a bunch of martial geeks sitting around going "I wonder how a martial art that doesn't exist, for a weapon that doesn't exist, would work" and everyone here realizes that (I would hope so). If you took the time to read in between the lines, or the other posts we make, you would see it.

Thank you for that Uilos, excellent point.

Coming on to a combat lightsaber forum and bashing members who wish to discuss the practical application of fictional martial arts forms is not only stupid, it is rude and pretentious.  I understand that we cannot flip around like Yoda or see strikes before they happen, but then again we do not have weightless infinitely sharp energy blades either.

We welcome opinions here, John-Michael, but do not take kindly to trolls dropping in to patronize us and disrupt discussions without any provocation.  Please feel free to post your opinions and further constructive conversation, but do so in a respectful manner.  We keep a mutual respect for each other here which allows people to post freely without fear of reprisal, keeping this forum friendly.

[John-Michael]

Heh.  Well, I thought I was actually being nice.

[Master Lucien Kane]

My goal is to develop the Seven Forms of lightsaber combat into seven styles of martial arts, of course for use with led sabers; not real lightsabers. 
What I'm doing is developing a sequence (kata) and a velocity (sparring drill) for each form. Then asking different dueling communities to submit their own sequences and velocities for whatever form they have a passion for. Each sequence and velocity would be reviewed for practicality and then either accepted, rejected or request revision.

What do you guys think? I don't see why we can't do it, martial arts styles were made by trial and error. Why not do it with the Seven Forms, then there could be curriculum for dueling clubs world wide.

[Kham-Ryn Kurios]

My goal is to develop the Seven Forms of lightsaber combat into seven styles of martial arts, of course for use with led sabers; not real lightsabers. 
What I'm doing is developing a sequence (kata) and a velocity (sparring drill) for each form. Then asking different dueling communities to submit their own sequences and velocities for whatever form they have a passion for. Each sequence and velocity would be reviewed for practicality and then either accepted, rejected or request revision.

What do you guys think? I don't see why we can't do it, martial arts styles were made by trial and error. Why not do it with the Seven Forms, then there could be curriculum for dueling clubs world wide.

It can happen we jsut gotta get it rolling although I don't really have experience to speak of.

[Master Artorius Vidnyl]

Having 20 years of martial arts experience (just over 5 years teaching now) I refrained from commenting in this thread after the little bomb was dropped.  Uilos, as usual, has just exactly what is going on.  We are members of a nerdy hobby who like to discuss hypothetical and nerdy things.  Do I think I can actually use a lightsaber?  Make me one and I'll show you.  However my skills with a katana, bo and other asian bladed and non-bladed weapons tell me that I can at least classify what sorts of concepts are shared between the philosophies of an art and one of our hypothetical "Forms."

It's just fun.

Cheers.

EDIT - I forgot to mention why I commented.  Get back to the discussion.  This has been thrown off topic enough.  Lucien, start the discussion if you want but somebody get on here and get us back on track.

[SOTJ]

-Do anyone of you actually practice those forms? Or do you fight just with instinct and to look cool in it?
-What is your prefered form and do you actually use it alot or do you mix it up, to make your own style?
-What you would like to be then? An Jedi or an Sith?

Back onto the original post.... I fight with instinct and it just ends up resembling Ataru. Which also answers the second question. And the third question.... Jedi, definitely. Although that feels like getting off topic for some reason